Alien Hive Order

[ZERO]

You will here many of us NS1 players declare Shift -> Creg -> Shade
There is very good reason for this and it will be explained below.

Any good strategy should assume that both teams are of equal skill or that your team is at a slight disadvantage. Therefore you need to think about what you gain from each of these hive selections and what the real benefits are:

Shift

Speed
Energy
Ability to spawn outside of start hive
Ability to energize around dropped shift

Creg

Health
Regen
Ability to regen buildings around creg

Shade

Silence
Cloak
Cloak building around shade


In the early game map control is most important and given the size and layout of most maps having speed is key. In addition if you need higher lifeforms to get a 3rd hive what upgrades are most and least valuable. Will shade upgrades help you get a 3rd hive as much as Creg or Shift, NO. Creg is second most important b/c by the time this upgrade comes around marines have weapons 2 and we need the health as a counter.

The one thing to realize is that it is not that you must do Shade last or that shade is bad. It is more that you ALWAYS want shift. You can still get a great combo with speed and silence and subvert the enemy position and counter attack. They key is that you are going to need armor upgrades when weapons 3 is out.

The value of shade for cloak is quickly lost when they hard counter with obs which they should be placing down in key points regardless. Both Shift and Creg are more direct counters to what the marines do in every game. That being trying to take map control and getting weapon upgrades.

It is fine to play around with different hive orders but do so knowing that your team NEEDS to be better than your opponent to actually win in the end.

[Chikun]

Yeah, shade is rather useless against a team that knows anything. However, going shade first before they get an observatory may be interesting early game.

[ZERO]

But the order of things for marines is usually: Amory -> obs -> phase tech

[Tickle Me Emo]

I've seen first hive shade drops devastate marines early game, with cloak providing enough of a surprise advantage to hold the map. That's rare, though, against competent marines, so I don't think it's a good strategy. I think shift should always be first for celerity alone. Second hive could go either way depending on how people are playing and how fast you are dropping hives and/or if you have multiple tech points locked down fairly well. I think crag is the safest build and shade is riskier with potential for high payoff. Silence is very nasty in NS2, since there is no motion sensing outside of obs range, and dropping shades all over the map means you have cloaked, silent aliens all over. Initiate paranoid marine mode, forcing them to play safer and lose map control, or suffer repeated death from previously mentioned cloaked and silent aliens. This works best if your team has a very good early game and takes control quickly. This means you control areas to put shades in, as well as provides the resources necessary for that kind of mass chamber deployment at an early point in the game. It also means early marine research is slowed due to lacking resources. If you don't have good map control, you won't have the areas for shades, you won't have the resources, and you risk not getting a third hive down to then get crag, which absolutely will be necessary as marines tech up.

TLDR: Shade is a great second chamber for snowballing games that are already going well, if aliens use it properly.

As a side note, if someone is planning on an early onos, always go crag. Period. If they do, you're obviously doing well, but crag is going to help that onos more every time.

[Chikun]

Shift is good for more eggs and in more areas closer to the battlefield. Also helps out a gorgie trying to speed production of a second hive if the commander drops one next to it.

[ZERO]

Also with the buff for cregs and regen the creg hive is better than ever! In fact Creg is now viable as a first hive b/c of the buffs.

[Chikun]

Buffs? When was this. I didn't see it in the changelog for the new build. :(

[ZERO]

The development team decided they are not going to report balance changes. Sort of like what I do with changes to WCS but in their case they say nothing. What is stupid is at least give us what I say for WCS like this is stronger this has longer range ect. Exact numbers not needed if they want to hide that but still acknowledgment of that they did would be nice.

In the last build: wip rage increased, cloak time decreased, cloaked movement speed reduced, creg healing speed/amount increased, regen buffed. Research time for leap reduced.

[Tickle Me Emo]

Regen is ridiculous now. With the buffs to it, I can't justify not going crag for the second hive. I still think shift is best for first, celerity is just too essential for map control and maximizing your ability to confuse marines in combat. Plus, regen on skulks works best alongside celerity, allowing you to get in and out of combat quickly, as well as dodge fire more effectively while regen does its thing. I won't even go in to regen on early onos...

Typing this as I wait for a slot on the server... really, really looking forward to reserved slots working.

[ZERO]

If I have 2 hives building at once like I usually do in refinery then I go shade for the second one.

[Tickle Me Emo]

I have spent the last two hours with an alien comm who goes shade/cloak -> crag/regen every single game and the marines are completely helpless. Cloak activates so fast now, it's incredibly easy to dodge behind pretty much anything, cloak and walk away, then re-attack. And once you get regen, GG. My opinion of cloak has been drastically altered, it's no longer just an initiation move, it is perfectly viable to cloak multiple times in an engagement. It's even easier when you get leap. Also, it's hilarious.

[ZERO]

However if the marines have two tech points before you get cloak once you do the logical response is to lock down, defend and tech b/c with obs you can not go in for the kill. Then they tech up all the way and puch out. If they have you locked to 2 hives and hold out they should win if you went shade/creg. However their com has to be good.

But yes the faster cloak is a lot better now.

[Tickle Me Emo]

And the patch has hit. Doubled out-of-combat activation time for regen and cloak to 3 seconds. Ah well, was fun while it lasted.

[Chikun]

It's still OP as hell early game for easy map control and to make the marines extremely paranoid if a gang of skulks are about to pop out of camouflage and rape their face.

I had an excellent game yesterday on a UWE server going Shade>Shift>Crag

[ZERO]

Why u no play on our server :mini triste:

[Chikun]

It's always full. :)

[ZERO]

Reserved slot works now... :wtg:

[Tickle Me Emo]

It's still OP as hell early game for easy map control and to make the marines extremely paranoid if a gang of skulks are about to pop out of camouflage and rape their face.

I had an excellent game yesterday on a UWE server going Shade>Shift>Crag

I would say it's still good, for the reasons you've stated, but not OP as hell. OP as hell is what it was before, allowing you to engage multiple marines as a skulk with virtually no risk. I feel like this patch made it an option for the commander, not a requirement, which is good.

[Chikun]

Word from the wise. Don't go shade hive first when half the team is green.