034 Alchemist [400] v1.0.5

[ZERO]

Alchemist
Required Level: 400
Levels per ability: 20
Item Restrictions: NONE
Special Notes: 70% Movement Speed | 50HP
Ironclad Alchemy: Gain % chance to convert incoming bullets within the radius into armor for himself and all teammates within that radius.
Equivalent Exchange: Chance to have damage done by himself or any teammate within the radius be converted directly into life which is divided amongst the players in that area.
Item Transmutation: Activating this ability will create an area at target location which you can then activate to temporarily disrupt items within range, preventing their use.
Scorched Earth: It will take some time to set up but once activated all your enemies within range will burn.


He may start with little health and speed but his abilities more than make up for his lack of direct combat skills.

http://www.ibisgaming.com/wcs_stats/player.php?id=106872




1.0.0

Initial Release


1.0.1

Max health gain limited to 400hp


1.0.2

Max health gain is now actually limited to 400hp
Increased speed to 60%


1.0.3

Users with ult immunity have 50% chance to evade ult dmg on each dmg hit.


1.0.4

Users with ult immunity have 50% chance to evade the ult on casting.


1.0.5

Increased speed to 70%
Alll users with ult immunity are immune to ult.




Special Credits (community members who contributed to the effects of this race)


Ironclad Alchemy sprite animation -Passarelli

[ZERO]

These are the plans for the new support class to be released with a reprogrammed and ability altered blood mage.

[acolyte_to_jippity]

what are the chances we're looking at for the abilities? and will they be converting all damage taken when they go off, or a portion?

[What]

So you might so his favorite music is......Full Metal


Also, the item disable thing, I'm assuming that would disable laces and what not. What about the periapt of health? Would the enemy lose 50 hp and could this potentially kill them? Same if they are jumping around with sock of feather, does that mean that gravity would suddenly turn on for them?

If so, sounds pretty cool, would need some testing to make sure the leaching abilities don't make him too op.

[Zackychuu]

Not sure about the class itself, would have to try it out in-game before forming an opinion.
I'm excited about having something else to work on rather than just re-playing op races.
Any estimate on the reprogramming of BM and release of this race?

[ZERO]

If it is not done in the next 25 days it will not be out until late May.

[What]

Are you planning on releasing it along with the bloodmage reprogram?

[CYBER]

yeah, this race needs to proc insanely imho to be actually viable considering that it needs to get up close and personal, while getting damaged to rly power up.

please tell me the "health gain" can overcap it's original starting hp, right? like santa/undead ?

im guessing the third ability is basically JUST a lace disabler? considering i cant think of any other item with range indicator?

i mean it's a nice skill to have, just very situational and it could use a better power? maybe if it can temporarily disable ALL item procs (wherther offensive like mask, defensive like helm or tactical like lace) on enemies within a radius for a short period of time. basically allowing the alchemist and teammates to nuke down an opponent for a very short period of time?


also, is that "disabler" skill on a cooldown? or consumable counts?


the ultimate, is it EXACTLY bloodmage's current ulti? or does is the ground set on fire momentarily as a scroching/damaging fire effect for a short duration after the proc is activated?

[ZERO]

Yes the item based ability is very complicated to implement and is planed to literally take away the items for a short time and give them back after. Massive amounts of code will be needed for that to work b/c I will need to reprogram the shop menu to add some more APIs. Also for the ult yea it is the same ability just with a cool effect added to it.

Yes they will release at the same time.

[CYBER]

Yes the item based ability is very complicated to implement


i hear ya.
i can only imagine someone attempting to buy an item while the enemy currently took away the weaps.
does it replace an old item if maxxed?
does it add on to the items if there's a free slot? is THAT item taken as well if the duration of alchemist is still active? or is it immune? etc...


perhaps to create a global "item_disabled" boolean state, zero?
where u simply add a boolean check before applying item effects if that state variable is false or true?

and then you toggle back that variable when the alchemist effect is over?
i just think that taking away items and back might create some null pointer problems like what used to happen to weapons taken away and given back by flying dragonfly/strider

anywho, u know better :)

[SCRIBBLE]

I am eager to see how nasty this race can get when used on a team with a shadow hunter and Athena. If the three stayed within range of each other they could do some work.

[kionay]

Unfortunately Alchemist seems to love teamwork

unfortunately because is all too rare, nevertheless this and the blood mage rework seems very interesting and i look forward to have a new class to die as :D

[ZERO]

Yea this race is going to be very effective if used correctly. Ideally a player would want to cast the item ability and the ult at the same time but then you got to get the cooldowns to match up...

As for physically taking them there are 2 ways:
1. create a global bool that lets there exist abilities that disable an item for a player but not their other abilities. Then modify the abilities and checks for items to check is a user currently is not allowed to get item bonus or not.
2. Take the items away and give them back after and do the same with the players cash during this time to prevent them buying anything during the effect. (This is really easy to do as it does not require me to make any real code changes to existing mods)

[kionay]

are athena/void laces counted as items? if so then how will they be affected if you use the second method? (maybe just a alchNoTouch modifier on those or something)

if you take away a player's money is that preventing it from increasing/decreasing or just putting it to 0 before you give it back?
if you prevent it from changing then won't blood mages be boned since their steal money ability will be nullified?
if you set to 0 then give them the money back afterwards if a blood mage hits someone affected by this then no money will be taken away, also boning the blood mage?

first blood mages have their ult stolen/changed then their money stealing abilities urinated on in a new situation this race will create

poor blood mages :(

*EDIT*
maybe you could add a null item that takes up a space, then swap a player's items with 3 null items (but not updating the list of items for the playerinfo)
that way they can't buy an item while under the effect (you'll be full) if they try to replace one then you can put in a simple IF statement to dissallow it if they're swapping out one of the special null items

their items will still be useless untill you switch them out (and good luck buying an item in the time between the NULL is removed and the item it held the spot for takes it's place)

[ZERO]

YEa did not think of blood mage steal being effected, thanks for reminding me of that :banghead:

[Wolfenstinger]

1 - 1016.

2 - How do anti_wards work right now? Do they activate and open up the item slot or remain in the item slot until the duration of the anti_ward has ended? I don't know if it'll also effect how Item Transmutation works as well.

[What]

antiwards still remain in the item slot until they have been completely used up.

[kionay]

also if someone is hit by an enemy weilding an orb of frost, will the person his be de-frosted if the person that hit them becomes under the alchemist's ult? probably not

will there be a problem with removing/adding amulet of the cat because of the float effect?

if at any point you prevent people from buying an item will it prevent them from buying tomes too? probably not THAT big of a deal to not buy a tome mid-game during that ult's duration, but still :-/

[Wolfenstinger]

also if someone is hit by an enemy weilding an orb of frost, will the person his be de-frosted if the person that hit them becomes under the alchemist's ult? probably not

will there be a problem with removing/adding amulet of the cat because of the float effect?

if at any point you prevent people from buying an item will it prevent them from buying tomes too? probably not THAT big of a deal to not buy a tome mid-game during that ult's duration, but still :-/

Theorycrafting from just logic and my understanding of how this race is suppose to work:

1- no
2- yes (note that when amulet of cat is not detected on player, they are heard but as soon as it is put on the player, they go silent)
3- yes it should be preventing people from buying tomes technically. a level up for that 1 point difference is still probably going to happen. Also I don't recall people spamming tome in the middle of gun fights.... Even if they have it bound.

[kionay]

Theorycrafting from just logic and my understanding of how this race is suppose to work:

1- no
2- yes (note that when amulet of cat is not detected on player, they are heard but as soon as it is put on the player, they go silent)
3- yes it should be preventing people from buying tomes technically. a level up for that 1 point difference is still probably going to happen. Also I don't recall people spamming tome in the middle of gun fights.... Even if they have it bound.

right on, well i don't know much about the mod back end, but from what i see i can't imagine a better way than my null item idea, or something similar

preventing people from buying won't cause too much of a problem, but BM might have a hissy fit

not sure how amulet of cat is applied/removed so i can't comment on that

where do new classes come from? does ZERO have an external site he pulls them from? are they all from our race sugestions?

ponder ponder ponder

[ZERO]

If they already exited it would not take months to make them. Translating existing code and building things that have been done before is very fast especially with all the conversion tools I made over the years to speed up the existing race programing. But to make races like this one which have never been done before and have such unique abilities that takes a long time.

[kionay]

If they already exited it would not take months to make them. Translating existing code and building things that have been done before is very fast especially with all the conversion tools I made over the years to speed up the existing race programing. But to make races like this one which have never been done before and have such unique abilities that takes a long time.

absolutely, very understandable, what i meant to ask was maybe more like --do you go out looking for a new race? like, think to yourself that it's time we had a new one and go looking for a good existing one (coz it'd be faster of course) or are you sort of always working on one at any given time, just we notice some being added quickly if they've already existed?

i was just wondering what the process was that ends with us getting a new race XD

[ZERO]

In the case of this one it came of the need to fill the role of a support class race the BM used to fill until it gets changed back to how it is supposed to work. As usual if I make a new race I want the abilities or at least one of them to be very unique and give the race something that will define it. If you look at all the races on the server now you notice how although some can be similar you can always tell what race is what b/c their external skills and playing style are so uniquely defining. It is also this uniqueness that I hope keeps players interested in the server as the races are not all just simple rehashes of the same thing over and over. As a result there is not going to be anyone that usually comes up with a here is all the skills exactly what your looking for in a new race.

In the case of this one I was watching FMABH when it was clear that a new race would be needed for the BM update. Thus I decided it would be an Alchemist. So I then went out looking for skills from other race ideas that fit with the race idea of an Alchemist. I then needed to find ideas from other races that could be altered to fit the character of this race and to work together with its other abilities to not be overpowered. The result of this research is what we have here. Sometimes this means getting rid of abilities that I originally wanted and replacing them with something more unique and defining. For example this race was going to have ability of the phosphors stone. When your team kills a player on the other team and then a teammate dies they can come back. I decided that in practice that there is currently enough resurrection style races, will there be more in the future yes but not not. Second the way that the skill was going to be used in play would not have a defining impact on the race. So I had to get rid of this ability and find something that would be just as useful but more unique and that worked with its other abilities in a logical manor.

[Passarelli]

This race looks great, and would do very well on camping maps such as Italy. Just camp in the house behind cover while your team pops out and shoots/gets shot at and you heal and give them armor. The ult sounds cool, though I am curious what kind of warning the opponents get to get out of dodge.



Also, the item disable thing, I'm assuming that would disable laces and what not. What about the periapt of health? Would the enemy lose 50 hp and could this potentially kill them? Same if they are jumping around with sock of feather, does that mean that gravity would suddenly turn on for them?


Unless Zero programs it specifically to damage people that have bought health, they should not lose their HP. Currently, periapt of health heals for 50 as soon as it is bought. This is why when losing badly I'll go magician, respawn as crow and buy lace, cloak, health, followed by ring to replace the health.

This would remove sock, helm, lace, claw, etc etc. I'm curious about the radius of the disable. If it is the same as the ult radius, we'll have a new class to turn to when the other team is fully itemed up.

If you find this class needs a buff, you could make it so when people get within half of the radius of the disable (if the disable is 30 yards and they get within 15 yards) you could cause the items to go haywire. Sock increases gravity, helm causes headshots to deal double damage, lace makes opponents ults twice as effective, and claw deals damage to you when you shoot someone. This would however require even more programming (essentially reprogramming items, or how items are coded)


Yes the item based ability is very complicated to implement and is planed to literally take away the items for a short time and give them back after. Massive amounts of code will be needed for that to work b/c I will need to reprogram the shop menu to add some more APIs.

Be careful with periapt of health. You would have to either add code so they take damage, or just ignore this item all together because currently if you lose it then get another, you get an extra 50 hp.

All said, I think this class looks very interesting. If you combine the item disable with races like night elf or athena, it would be downright absurd. I can't wait to play it!

[the_best_noob]

Currently having mixed opinions. This would of course be an excellent counter to stacked and fully itemed teams, but it could also stack teams so much so that there is no hope of recovering. I wish there was damage and a better description of the ult, because if it was a powerful one, then this class would, in my opinion, be very overpowered. The ability that disables lace in combination of the ultimate would simply be too powerful if the ultimate does lots of damage or has some other wildly game changing effect. Still, I'm really excited. Also, the new max level would be 1016 unless I can't add.

[Wolfenstinger]

Currently having mixed opinions. This would of course be an excellent counter to stacked and fully itemed teams, but it could also stack teams so much so that there is no hope of recovering. I wish there was damage and a better description of the ult, because if it was a powerful one, then this class would, in my opinion, be very overpowered. The ability that disables lace in combination of the ultimate would simply be too powerful if the ultimate does lots of damage or has some other wildly game changing effect. Still, I'm really excited. Also, the new max level would be 1016 unless I can't add.

How is it that you have no hope of recovering? There is ALWAYS .... and i mean ALWAYS a counter within the madness of madness. Just gotta be a little creative with it and splash more bullets at it.

[Passarelli]

Currently having mixed opinions. This would of course be an excellent counter to stacked and fully itemed teams, but it could also stack teams so much so that there is no hope of recovering. I wish there was damage and a better description of the ult, because if it was a powerful one, then this class would, in my opinion, be very overpowered. The ability that disables lace in combination of the ultimate would simply be too powerful if the ultimate does lots of damage or has some other wildly game changing effect. Still, I'm really excited. Also, the new max level would be 1016 unless I can't add.

Haven't you heard?
8367
The bird is the word.

If you are losing badly, the easiest and best way to recover is get 1 person to go bloodmage and 3+ people go magician. Bloodmage camps somewhere safe, the magicians all go suicide, as soon as they respawn as birds, get lace, cloak, and health, then switch health for a ring.

Also, keep in mind that the ultimate has a delay (and will likely have some sort of warning to gtfo) which is when the birds all up in smoke. Also, remember the item disable is activated, so as soon as it is used, you can up in smoke. I don't think it would be that hard to counter with this kind of setup.

I think this class would actually be better for the losing team, because you can only do the above setup with team cooperation and when you are losing by 7-9 rounds. This would be a easier way for a single player to help clear the opposing teams items. I'm just worried about the range of it. I'd say anyone the alchemist shoots while the disable is active should at least have helm be ignored regardless of distance, otherwise it wouldn't help much on maps like italy or aztec where the routes to the objective are all long wide open spaces--especially since this race has no enhanced movement.

Then again, pie-q and Brice would probably love this race and use it to counter my die xonvert with helm which is the best way I can counter their absurd HS bullshit.

Zero, I'm curious as to how exactly the armor bonus works. Would the shots need to land near/on you (either hit you or a wall/ground nearby) or will it work if bullets pass within X radius of you, regardless of their final destination. Also, with the ultimate--when you hit it, will it go off even if there are no opponents nearby?

[ZERO]

Please post suggestions for how the effects should look for the different abilities. Ideally describe them as if you were actually programing them.

[ZERO]

Please note that a LOT of the abilities of this race inherently work VERY differently from ALL existing races. Therefore it takes a SHIT TON more time to create this race as a lot of the code must be invented b/c nothing does anything like this for things like the bullets and the items. This is in order to have these abilities work smoothly and make sense in actual game play.

The good news is the methods used to create these new types of abilities will advance the capacity to create even more exciting and dynamic abilities in the future.

This race will require multiple testing phases to ensure that the new ability types work as intended.

(IE releasing test versions that do not even have the correct proc rates or 100% proc rates or no cool downs to just see that the abilities actually work)

Thus do not freak out if you see 100% proc rates in testing. I will let you know when release proc rates and balance have been applied to a given ability for testing.

[ZERO]

Please note that Ironclad Alchemy is an evasion type ability. However in addition to negating the very existence of the shot (thus preventing anything said shot would have proced) it also then turns this evaded shot into armor for it and its friends. This makes Ironclad Alchemy literally the most powerful evasion ability in the entire game. However, it does have a drawback as compared to all other current evasions being that it only stops bullets. This means that things like abilities for example or even knives are not effected in any way from this ability. So fear not you need to just think differently about the sorts of weapons to engage with when facing a group of opponents supported by an Alchemist. In the future there will also be more races that deal a lot of non bullet damage and these will be very effective at breaking up this ability advantages.

[ZERO]

Wow 100 lines of looping code for that ability and that was the least amount of code to do it in... :banghead:

[the_best_noob]

*Pats on the back*

It's for the greater good.

[ZERO]

The effect for Ironclad Alchemy will be to have a circle move inward toward the user starting at the current range of the ability then after it hits them the beams will shoot from them to the players that got armor. This represents the bullet hitting the edge of the area of effect and being channeled to the alchemist and then being distributed as armor to the players within range.

As a reminder note that for balance only bullets that were actually going to hit a target are intercepted. (otherwise armor gain rates would be out of control)

[ZERO]

If anyone can locate transmutation circles for the Alchemist abilities and post them that would be great. I will also work on finding some myself that relate to the abilities.

[Xerenix]

https://www.google.se/search?q=alchemist+transmutation+circle&espv=2&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=iCecU_jBH4iCzAP5joKwBQ&ved=0CB0QsAQ&biw=2133&bih=1061&dpr=0.9

Scorched Earth - http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2012/194/9/8/flame_alchemist_transmutation_circle_by_eamcline-d572o8e.png

Item Transmutation - http://pad1.whstatic.com/images/thumb/e/e2/Draw-a-Transmutation-Circle-Intro.jpg/635px-Draw-a-Transmutation-Circle-Intro.jpg

Equivalent Exchange - http://fc04.deviantart.net/fs45/f/2009/104/2/3/transmutation_circle_by_haudankaivajasi.jpg

[ZERO]

The one you listed for Item Transmutation is used to make people...

[ZERO]

I was thinking this for the item one (animation speed would be different and a secondary one to hold the final form:

[ZERO]

I tried to make the suggested Scorched Earth look better here it is so far:

8583

[ZERO]

I think I will need to start over from scratch so I can enlarge before the white data gets in there to prevent issues.

I got to make the one for Scorched Earth really really big or I can use multiple effect circles as it casts that start to go below the targets right before they are hit.

[ZERO]

Another Scored Earth option: (50% res)
8584

[ZERO]

The premise with the one above is that during the 5 second delay that the ult is activating (after the ult is cast!). The circle expands outward from the caster to encompass the area of effect which when fully leveled will be fucking massive. The ult for this race is intended to be very very powerful. The 5 seconds of this effect is the warning bell to the other team to kill the alchemist now or be destroyed. This obviously reveals both the alchemist position and the effect area offering the chance to escape if you can.

In case it has not been obvious enough this ability is going to have even more range than the old BM ult.

[kionay]

Another Scored Earth option: (50% res)

that.... looks freaking AWESOME

please use that one

[Xerenix]

The more complex ones doesn't affect performance at all? If so then the second Scorched earth one definitely looks better.

[ZERO]

No as they are sprites, they use as much performance as in in game spray lol.

The effects that Jack uses are largely custom sprites that is why you dl the images for it.

[CYBER]

yeah i like the the second (50% rez one) more if it doesnt impact performance. I like the fact that the lines are relatively thing, and if possible, keep them somewhat translucid because the last thing u want is this race to be blocking sight?

I also don't mind the item transmutation one u used in ur zip file, i just dnt rly like the animation of it much, i think it could have been better animated if it started from the center triangle, then the next bigger piece and the next, then the three circles, then bam full drawing. center outwards... but hey if it works..

- - - Updated - - -

question tho. are u making the animation sprite for the ultimate "see through" in the walls? like the rapscallion? seeing as u want the race to have a super strong ult compensated by a warning?


If so, can i suggest a final thing about the animation u are doing?
i can see that u are trying to make an expanding disc from the center of the ultimate caster, until full range right? (where the disc is that sprite).
My suggestion is to add one tiny last animation AFTER the disc fully expands, and it's to rotate that disc on its horizontal axis to flip it upside down very very fast to indicate that the scortched earth just bursted?

this removes the guessing if the alchemist got killed while casting? THIS way, if the disc FULLY swiveled at the end, it indicates the ultimate was completely casted, and not interrupted by killing the alchemist.
AND The reason why i suggest this is because we know that this ultimate's range is sperical, so ppl who are on different altitudes can actually see the vertical range of it mere milliseconds before the sphere rotates fully and activates.



This will basically create a fast spherical animation if u follow the rotation line in the following image, just before the ultimate activates.

http://blogs.jccc.edu/astronomy/files/2012/01/Celestial-Spere-2.jpg

[the_best_noob]

I really like the warning concept on the ult.

Not only does the Alchemist support the team, the team has to defend the Alchemist for however long the charge-up is.

This also allows for a distraction, say a sneaky bomb plant while everyone is hunting for the alchemist. Or suppose a lion came in while the team started hunting down the Alchemist and caused absolute total chaos among the enemy team.

[Wolfenstinger]

This also allows for a distraction, say a sneaky bomb plant while everyone is hunting for the alchemist. Or suppose a lion came in while the team started hunting down the Alchemist and caused absolute total chaos among the enemy team.

Vagalion walks into a room with 5 other people in it. Only Cyber is found dead. (or whoever I'm aiming for... :smirk:)

[kionay]

Vagalion walks into a room with 5 other people in it. Only Cyber is found dead. (or whoever I'm aiming for... :smirk:)

hahahaha

whenever there is vagalion, there is wolf


anyway

cyber the spherical thing sounds nice, but while the sprite doesn't cause shit for lag, wouldn't flipping it around in, say, crackhouse cause for quite a bit of confusion? (RED LINES EVERYWHERE WTF!)

[ZERO]

There will be other visual cues besides just the sprites alone for all of the effects as to ensure that their effect areas and current status are clear.

[CYBER]

Vagalion walks into a room with 5 other people in it. Only Cyber is found dead. (or whoever I'm aiming for... :smirk:)



hey fuck you!
of all the people, i'd like to think i give you SOME challenge in knifing me...

</3 me no like u ...

fucking Dean 2.0

[ZERO]

Entered initial testing phase.

[Wolfenstinger]

anyway to grant extra points in levelbank or should I just get on an alt account to mess with it?

[ZERO]

Yea I got to reset the level banks to have more base levels now lol.

[Passarelli]

Zero, I hope you can figure out how to get armor to go above 125 : /

Actually, after a little research - Having a lot of armor isn't super effective. As long as you have 1 armor, it will reduce the amount of damage the same from the first shot as if you bought a full vest. The max values (from standard 100 hp) needed for full reduction is ~57--and that is only for the starting pistols.

Depending on the power of the race how it is currently should be okay (maybe give people that gain armor a free helmet). If it is slightly weak, you may want to change it from bonus armor to something like:
Reduces damage for yourself and all teammates in range by (amt of damage that would have been taken)/(number of players in range) for x seconds or 1 hit or something like that.

Armor was a great idea, but I was thinking now NS works with armor and not so much CS:S.

For numbers reference:
http://counterstrike.wikia.com/wiki/Kevlar_%2B_Helmet

[ZERO]

Remember that it also has an ability that gives players health and these abilities are also negating damage in their entirety. It is also possible that I may make this some sort of special armor where as the armor of players within the same range if they have any gets better properties than normal armor does. Like forcing all damage to armor first for example.

Never count me out of options lol, I can just invent something new and even more powerful, muahaha.

Also note the FF counting is to be fixed and inversely tested on night elf to see if it is in there too.

[CYBER]

Remember that it also has an ability that gives players health and these abilities are also negating damage in their entirety. It is also possible that I may make this some sort of special armor where as the armor of players within the same range if they have any gets better properties than normal armor does. Like forcing all damage to armor first for example.

Never count me out of options lol, I can just invent something new and even more powerful, muahaha.

Also note the FF counting is to be fixed and inversely tested on night elf to see if it is in there too.


I'd say to cap the armor at 100.
but any "armor leeching" above 100 will give upgrade it to a free helmet as well.


I think ALCHEMIST race ONLY should treat armor differently, and use armor to mitigate more dmg than what the Source reduction values are.
And i think a good formula for "armor mitigation" it's smthn like :

registeredDamage =incomingSourceDamage/ (1+CurrentArmor/100)

Note that the above formula REQUIRES an armor cap of 100% so it's not a broken skill.

This will basically make it so that a FULL armor set, with the helm, can reduce the first shot of incoming dmg by half, and then proportionally to that later on until u have zero armor, then the dmg received is normal to wtvr the current source engine armor mitigations.

So alchemist can be more of a "tanky + sustain" race

[ZERO]

Well the real reason that you needed that extra armor gain was to help keep the Alchemist alive. Keep in mind that I still plan to give him 50% movement speed and even a reduced starting health. What I will do is make it so that only for the Alchemist himself he will be able to have 100% of incoming bullet damage hit the armor 100% before taking his health. Note that this would not be a hit intercept so abilities that trigger still do so and those deal dmg directly to health like always.

So basically there is a passive armor ability for this race then.

[Passarelli]

Remember that it also has an ability that gives players health and these abilities are also negating damage in their entirety. It is also possible that I may make this some sort of special armor where as the armor of players within the same range if they have any gets better properties than normal armor does. Like forcing all damage to armor first for example.

Never count me out of options lol, I can just invent something new and even more powerful, muahaha.

Also note the FF counting is to be fixed and inversely tested on night elf to see if it is in there too.

I completely forgot about NE. FF does proc evasion on live. I noticed it a couple days ago and forgot to mention it.

[ZERO]

Patched version now on test server also includes final effects for the first ability.

[ZERO]

Note that he will only give teammates health gain sharing once his health is at least 100. (He will start with 50hp)

[ZERO]

You really do not realize until you go to actually make it but this is literally the loopiest program of all time. Which makes it a very dangerous program and why it is taking so long.

[ZERO]

Equivalent Exchange is now ready for testing.

[ZERO]

Please note that you can give yourself more levels in your level bank via the !morelevels command.

[ZERO]

What I can do for the items is create a placeholder item and give users that. If they have the placeholder item item costs will be increased to 999999999999 so they can not buy any. Item will be removed after.

Now what health related items need to have special rules.

[CYBER]

What I can do for the items is create a placeholder item and give users that. If they have the placeholder item item costs will be increased to 999999999999 so they can not buy any. Item will be removed after.

Now what health related items need to have special rules.
what was the reason behind this placeholder item?

[ZERO]

Basically it means I can release the race 3-8 weeks faster. This is becuase I can detect the existence of the placeholder item and then know to charge users with that item more money.

Yes that also means that the price will be normal if your in the area of effect and do not already own something but if you do buy something at that time it will be instantly taken away and then given back to you b/c the processing of the ability is going to work as a ward but a ward that disables items rather than damages players.

[Passarelli]

I'm pretty sure the only item that needs special coding will be Periapt of Health. There are two ways of doing it that I can think of. The first would be to remove bonus health above the maximum allowed by the race and the other is to remove 50 hp down to a minimum of 1 hp. The latter would definitely be more powerful. Either way, you may want to compensate for any health lost thus far from the round.

Examples
Method 1
Max human with PoH was shot once and has 180 HP. He is hit by the Alchemist's ward. His health drops to 150. When the debuff wears off he would either go back to 200 HP or 180 HP, depending on if you compensate.

Method 2
Player with PoH is nearly dead and has 20 HP left. He is hit by the Alchemist's ward. His health drops to 1. When the debuff wears off he would either go back to 20 HP or 50 HP, depending on if you compensate.

When you finish with your planned items, I could see Heavy Boots of Armor, Life Preserver, and Stone of Health having the same issues.


I'll try to find two people so I can test out Equivalent Exchange tomorrow.

EDIT:

By the way, when you finish this class you may want to expedite Tome of Health. Especially if you decide to go with method 2.

[CYBER]

We did some testing zero:
1- The ability's text said that Equivalent Exchange will heal for damage done BY Alchemist or his allies. I think you meant to say ONTO alchemist and allies. (currently EE gives you some health when u or ally gets shot, not when YOU shoot someone.). You might wanna fix that description because it's confusing.

2- At first I was telling passerelli that currently, EE's description has another confusing part. When you get shot by a bullet, currently it applies the bullet damage and THEN mitigates some of that damage:
For testing purposes, we turned off Iron Clad ability to confirm this:
- If you are alone, and have 100 hp, and get shot for 50 dmg and EE procs . Your HP after the shot will be 100. in other words, EE treated that bullet damage and then healed u for that 50(almost like evading that bullet NOT OVERHEALING). Personally, the description of the ability made it sound like if you had 100 hp, and got shot with 50dmg, and EE proc'd, that your final hp will be 150 as opposed to 100... in other words, the entire bullet got negated and transmuted into HP... which isn't the case.
- If you are with a partner, and you both have 100 hp. and u get shot for 50dmg, and your EE procs. YOUR hp at the end of the shot will be 75 (from 100 hp, minus 50 dmg, + 50 hp split by 2 = 75hp total), while your ally's final hp will be 125! (from 100 hp, minus nothing bcos he didnt get shot, + 50 split by 2 = 125hp total)


At first i was displeased because the description makes it look like the entire bullet will be EVADED and THEN you OVERHEAL by some hp... that's what i assumed the entire time from reading the description... So that's also some wording you need to fix... unless that ability is supposed to completely evade that bullet? in which case it's not working properly.


That being said, if u are walking alone as an alchemist, i kinda was bummed that u couldn't overheal when being shot ... and it simply acts like an instant shadow hunter absorption of that bullet. HOWEVER, when i thought of a scenario with multiple alchemists in this huge 60ft radius... and some human camping somewhere constantly getting healed over and over and over... yeah... i can imagine how this race can easily become overpowered.

Also we tested the range on EE. Your aura will heal ally for 60ft, which is about the width of the crackhouse building.

So clearly right now i'm pro making the bullet go through and THEN mitigate partially with EE, as opposed to overhealing and negating bullet which will be op as fuck considering multiple Alchemists AND the fact that it also has an ironclad evade.



3- About the armor gain, you said that the race will start with 50 hp and that damage will first have to go through its armor before it hits its hp right?
If that's the case, i even insist MORE on the fact that EE stays the way it is, just fix the description typo mentioned in part 1.


4- about the item transmutation thing. I was told by passerelli that it's a fixed ward? or is it a moving aura around u that can be activated X times in 1 round?
if fixed ward, how many wards do u get?

5- IF it's a ward, can u make sure the ward DOESNT look like a ward? Make it like a translucid light golden bubble or some shit? because i wonder if ppl will start bitching that it's a ward and should be treated the same way as shadow hunter wards around objectives and houses, when in reality the ability itself is nothing similar to shadow hunter or strider ward since it does no damage? u understand my concern? last thing we want is this race crippled near objectives and houses... which is where it shines the most...

------------------------


on a completely different note : SINCE WHEN IS A BACKKNIFE 195 fucking damage? it ALWAYS was 165 dmg, i know that from a fact in gg server bcos i backnife all the time... and yet in wcs and wikis online, it showed it as 195? this completely confused the fuck out of me when doign the EE heal at first, since i thought there was a bug where the 165 backknife hp /2 was giving 98 hp instead of 87...u see why im curious?

[the_best_noob]

I haven't tested it myself, but didn't we also find a potential discrepancy with sock of the feather? Maybe you tested that and it doesn't cause issues, I dunno.

[Passarelli]

Cyber, remember that only one EE will proc at a time. I'm not even sure if you get an extra chance to proc EE or ironclad with multiple alchemists within range. That is the only way I can see it getting out of hand. Imagine Night Elf camping Italy with 3 alchemists each giving him Ironclad. If Ironclad is 30% chance, the NE would end up with 75% evade. The alchemists would be able to rotate their wards to make sure that someone could always get entangled. It just gets too crazy. That's why I kinda doubt the buffs stack.

Zero, so you know the tooltip is very wrong



Equivalent Exchange: Chance to have damage done by himself or any teammate within the radius be converted directly into life which is divided amongst the players in that area.
.

The way this reads, it should be when the alchemist or an ally deals damage they gain health instead of when they take damage.


Also, anytime Ironclad procced, Evolution's game crashed. Could you let us know what he needs to delete or at least how to properly troubleshoot this?

[ZERO]

Ah I see the ability was working backwards I see the 2 lines that were inverted in the code and inverted them again so it should be correct now.

[ZERO]

We noticed something like this earlier in testing with that ability but then it randomly stopped. Given that it works exactly the same code as Jacks effects we were not able to show that the effect itself or ability caused the crashing. We also got it to crash without having any related races running and we later got it to work normally without issue for a good amount of time.

We might learn more as additional effects are programed.

[Passarelli]

Oh, cool! So it is a life leech effect then! When we first started testing we went alchemist against shadow hunter and couldn't figure out why it wasn't proccing.

Is this going to stack with vamp aura for Undead?

[ZERO]

Will only proc from bullet damage. (ie not any dmg abilities unless one of those dmg abilities uses bullet dmg type)

[ZERO]

Can anyone confirm that Ironclad Alchemy does cause the shot to be evaded and that no damage is taken.

[Passarelli]

Ironclad does indeed count as an evade. It also evades some abilities such as critical grenades. Not sure if it will evade all abilities, but it can definitely evade some.

[ZERO]

Interesting, that means that critical grenade is currently sending dmg as a bullet this will change when that race is recoded. Currently all dng types are set or should be set to physical (direct health dmg). After the great reprogram I will then start to change this for some abilities for balance as needed.

Note that I plan to give an additional ability to the armor created from the alchemist that it can absorb some of any dmg done to the user. It might be something like 50%. So instead of doing 25hp dmg it does 12.5 hp dmg and 12.5hp armor (rounds). It will only do this for armor gained from the alchemist ability or for the alchemist any armor you have.

[Passarelli]

Cool. I know I have dodged critical grenades to my face as night elf on live. It is as if when you dodge the grenade damage, you also dodge the crit grenade ability. I like the "Evade has protected you from ~200 damage" you get when it happens. XD

Oh, and I'll see if I can get a couple people to help test out the revised EE sometime today. Maybe I'll pull in Cyber again so I don't have to type as much XD

[ZERO]

Yea if you doge the dmg you prevent any ability so even if an ability would have triggered it no longer does b/c the hit never took place to begin with. Obviously this ability though is only for bullets and not grenades and other stuff. Evade for example dodges all damage regardless of type. (shit it even dogged ff dmg before lol)

[ZERO]

To balance slightly and make things more interesting for the way this race operates / staying true to the Alchemist way of using abilities. I am planning to make the Item Transmutation ability work a bit differently. You will press ability 1 to draw it and then at a later time you can press ability 2 to activate it. You will be able to make up to 2 of them.

This way you can still cast all of them at the same time even though you move slow by setting them up first. In addition this creates a counter to this powerful ability as the Alchemist can not move for the few seconds it takes to create the transmutation circle. This time will go down to only like .5 seconds when fully leveled.

It will look different in its dormant state and can at that time create a sense of fear to users who pass over it wondering if it is suddenly going to activate at that time! Once activated it will last for a varying length of time depending on how leveled the ability is as originally planned.

I hope that this change will not only improve balance for this amazing ability but will also create some more tension and exciting interactions between players :wtg:

[ZERO]

That feeling when your using a graphing calculator to determine the increment for an ability to level by....

The new standard of ability leveling perhaps? Smaller global function memory usage 100% linear incrementation (or non linear (I could have an ability level up however I want with simpler var changes now)).

Remember that every time I am making a new race I am always looking for ways to improve the code to all future races and to make things like balance changes faster and easier.

[ZERO]

Nothing like waking up to programing multi dimensional array cleaners in the morning. Well I was going to need some new functions sets like this sooner or later.

Reprogramed the code used to calculate wards (used for many things that you would not think are wards, basically finds all clients of a defined team or all teams within X range of a point and then hits a call back method individually for each time one is found.) as there is only 1 call back function there was no way to do different things until now.

With the new code I can now for example have different wards with different things done to clients all while using the same code and functions. This makes code easier to read and debug by reducing as much as possible duplicate code.

[ZERO]

It is from where your standing. It will take 2 to 0.5 seconds it will last 3-10 seconds once activated. Area slightly larger than shadow hunter ward radious right now. All variables are subject to change as we balance it.

You can make 2 per round. You can activate them at the same time if you have 2 planted. Pressing the activation button will always trigger the first one and then the second one.

You will be frozen for that 2-0.5 seconds that it takes to deploy.

[ZERO]

Oh looks like it is time to clean up the code used for ability triggers rofl. Well the good news is at this point I think I will be getting pretty close to standardizing and fully optimizing all the standard code methodology used for every single race soon. (means future coding is much much faster b/c all the optimization has already been done correctly to begin with (also easier to read and edit code))

Example:

Before:

public OnAbilityCommand( client, ability, bool:pressed )
{
//Plant
if( War3_GetRace( client ) == thisRaceID && ability == 0 && pressed && IsPlayerAlive( client ) )
{
new skill_level = War3_GetSkillLevel( client, thisRaceID, SKILL_WARD );
if( skill_level > 0 )
{
if( !Silenced( client ) )
{

}
}
}

//Activate
if( War3_GetRace( client ) == thisRaceID && ability == 1 && pressed && IsPlayerAlive( client ) )
{

}
}

After:

public OnAbilityCommand( client, ability, bool:pressed )
{
if(War3_GetRace(client) == thisRaceID && IsPlayerAlive(client))
{
//Plant
if(ability == 0 && pressed)
{
new skill_level = skill_level_item[client];
if(skill_level > 0 && !Silenced(client))
{

}
}

//Activate
if(ability == 1 && pressed)
{
new skill_level = skill_level_item[client];
if(skill_level > 0 && !Silenced(client))
{

}
}
}
}

Notice that redundant duplicate code was eliminated allowing for better permanence reduced possibility of errors and increased readability. Rather than keep rechecking the same dam thing multiple times it is done once. In this case it is further optimized by moving the skill level check to its own statement as well (but this could be for 2 different abilities and you logically would test those individually within the defined statement. Also I will be testing with an else if b/c it appears this method is called on a case by case basis and so there can be some benefit to not running unnecessary code. In fact a switch statement might be passable as well to improve optimization to the highest possible degree.

[ZERO]

Yep there we go fully optimized:

public OnAbilityCommand( client, ability, bool:pressed )
{
if(War3_GetRace(client) == thisRaceID && IsPlayerAlive(client))
{
if(pressed)
{
switch (ability)
{
//Plant
case 0:
{
new skill_level = skill_level_item[client];
if(skill_level > 0 && !Silenced(client))
{

}
}

//Activate
case 1:
{
new skill_level = skill_level_item[client];
if(skill_level > 0 && !Silenced(client))
{

}
}
}
}
}
}

Note that with only 2 cases there is not any major performance gain as it should be almost exactly the same as an if else but as soon as there is more than 2 this method is better and is thus preferred. Also it can make things easier to read.

[ZERO]

Here a switch would help b/c it would reduce the number of times you need to read from an array but without making the code messy by creating a temp var:


if(ClientItemWards[client]==0)
{

}
else if(ClientItemWards[client]==1 && skill_level >= SecodWardUnlockLevel)
{

}

vs


switch (ClientItemWards[client])
{
case 0:
{

}

case 1:
{
if(skill_level >= SecodWardUnlockLevel)
{

}
}
}

[ZERO]

Holy crap, nearly 500 lines later I got the basic structure for the ability casting and creating the structure to find players to ban from having items.

It turns out there is supposed to be a buff for disabling items called bPerplexed but it is not implemented. For the sake of simplicity I will do it that way and then just make a special case for abilities that are not activated. Thus while a user has the bPerplexed buff their items will simply not work. If they have an item that is a 1 time grant like health I will just detect that and remove and give back the health if the user still has the item when it is time for them to get the restored amount.

[ZERO]

Item Transmutation is now in a basic testing phase. You can not currently see where it is cast even. This is just to test that there is no crashes ect. You should not be able to buy items right now when your hit by it. You do get a message telling you what is going on.

[ZERO]

Got a lot of testing done today and cleaned up a lot of bugs. Now I can see what needs to be done to get the item ability fully working. It will be annoying to code but it will work. I have also uncovered other bugs that people where having with that crash issue on the effect that is now corrected and I am cleaning up some other errors as well in my natives for some new functions which were invented along with this race.

Also does anyone know how I can view the contents of the materials and models now that valve has removed them?

[ZERO]

Transmutation ability has been completed. It should now actually remove and give back all of an effected users items. Please test and confirm and report any glitches. If there is any item that has bad removal behavior like health (will be fixed) let me know so we can deal with what should happen to a client when they lose such an item.

NOTE THAT THERE IS CURRENTLY NO EFFECT SET. You WILL get CHAT MESSAGES indicating as to what is going on.

[ZERO]

Updated to latest version with Iron animation provided by Passarelli. (now fades in and out) Also reduced time iron shows from 1 second to 0.75

[ZERO]

Item Transmutation ability has a basic effect now. I will be making improvements and reducing greatly its dl size.

Please test and ensure this ability is fully operational. It should be fully functional and bug free.

[ZERO]

Updated all sprites to use new lower file size method. Updated sprites to now support correct program side scaling. Reprogrammed to only require 1 animated sprite instead of multiples for cases when a different size or animation direction was needed (reduces file size).

Now that I got this last problem solved I can finish up the current effects and then start on the ultimate.

[ZERO]

Now ready for new testing!

Item Transmutation Effect finished
new code allows for looping rings from stock functions!
fix for size of iron ring effect (apparently the programers who made these functions do not know the difference between diameter and radios (they actually meant diameter))
Optimized sprite file sizes


Let me know what you all think of the effect for the transmutation. If it is too much I can remove the 4 lines and circles that go out facing upright.

Anyways, lots of advancements with how I can deal with effects and even other complex repeated functions in the future. This can really help to improve the code for many other races to increase performance and reduce errors.

I now should be able to fully translate ANY es/python es_tools based effect over to SM. So if you can find any really cool ones you would like to see for a particular ability post them up in the appropriate forum.



It is late now so I got to get some rest. :wtg:

[ZERO]

Updated again

New method for dynamic ability values based on current level implemented
Effects for exchange finished and up for full public testing
New effect which allows "shooting" a beam implemented.
All abilities except for the Ult are now finished and ready for final release testing.

[Blackmage]

Note to anyone who doesn't know. To activate the second half of item trans, use +ability1.

[ZERO]

Ok the hold up right now is that I am going to need to globalize the setting and ending of users on fire. There will need to be a plugin that I create that is only responsible for that and can track users who are on fire ect. This is so that multiple plugins can set users on fire at the same time ect without conflicts. This would prevent the fire effect from vanishing on players early due to a conflict.

[ZERO]

Ok, I think the easiest way to do this would be to have a plugin that allows users to set themselves on fire and then other plugins force users to run that command on themselves to activate the fire.

[ZERO]

Ult ability is finished. Note that the cooldown is reduced by 10x so you are able to test it faster. No effects are currently finished for it other than actually setting the players on fire. Improvements have been made over the method used for the new bloodmage burn to reduce the number of global vars and checks by 1. If it works fine I can then alter the BM to use the same code for its release.

Please report any bugs. I will now be working on trying to get the effects for this ability to work without being a massive DL and I will be working on how I will fully implement the special armor part of Iron Alchemy.

[ZERO]

Also for those wondering still wtf is taking so long keep in mind that this is literally the most complex race from a programing perspective developed thus far. Even without counting the hundreads and hundreads of lines of stock functions made during this races development it is already well over 1000 lines of code long. Most races are significantly simpler than this one and when I reprogram them it will not take nearly as long.

[ZERO]

I found that the code in war3 was actually preventing me from setting more than 125 armor. The limit is now removed for this races ability.

[ZERO]

I think I found a way to smooth the animations (which can reduce the file size by lowering the number of actual animations) but it makes the sprite glow. This then causes the colors to be lighter than I intend so maybe I can fix that by making them darker for the animations. Also I believe I have found a method to parent sprites to ents. With this the creation of extremely complex effects which were previously impossible to be made. I hope to use these discoveries to further improve effects for this race before release.

[ZERO]

Discovered a bug where instead of disabling the targets items the caster lost his items instead ROFL :banghead:

[ZERO]

All abilities and their effects should now be fully working. All effects are in final release status.

[ZERO]

All settings adjusted for final release status. All balance settings set to final release status. All negative Buffs for this race are set to final release status.

Please report ALL ERRORS.
Please report ANY BALANCE ISSUES.

Note that this race, the new BM and the Noob Shield are ALL IN FINAL RELEASE TESTING. PLEASE REPORT ALL ERRORS BEFORE PUBLIC RELEASE.

[Wolfenstinger]

Tried Item Transmutation - effect appears fine and activating looks pretty. I didn't see any way of seeing my CDs though? Don't know if you can implement it.

Scorched Earth - game crashes. Don't even get to see it happen I guess.

Will probably try later with somebody in game.

[ZERO]

To confirm Scorched Earth Crashed when you tried to cast it.

[Wolfenstinger]

To confirm Scorched Earth Crashed when you tried to cast it.

Yes. When I tried again today, was on de_dust2 T spawn going towards long A, and I was able to actually cast it there in the open. I saw the red beacon indicating that I was casting and the message stating I would be frozen for 10 seconds. Well, I counted to 10 and then hit my +ultimate button again, nothing. I hit +ability1 thinking it'd show something and nothing. After I decided to move, is when I crashed.

Came back on de_piranesi and crashed multiple times trying to replicate what I did in CT spawn.

I'll have a 2nd person later today to mess with it for a bit.

[ZERO]

BTW you only cast it 1 time. It then takes 10sec to go into effect.

Do you see any sort of red sprite, I think that is the problem.

[ZERO]

The issue was missing files in the fast dl server. The issue is now fixed.

[ZERO]

Fixed the commented out line that was supposed to freeze you when you activate the ult. All abilities should now be 100% correct now.

[ZERO]

The issue of having the ult effect not show up due to it being too large for the engine to allow decompression has been resolved. The solution was to split it into two smaller files and replace the animation when part of the way done. I am tuning it so that this translation will not be noticeable by users.

[ZERO]

Updated so that the armor is now applied as it should be.

[ZERO]

Item transmutation ability will be a ranged cast which will deploy anywhere you are currently looking (think of how destinations for teleportation are handled)

[ZERO]

Ok the planting of the transmutation ability at range works.

[ZERO]

rare error where one of the 2 dimensional arrays gave a memory access error has been corrected. Now only the parts of the memory system that are deployed at that time will be cleaned. I have checked and the secondary function already accounts for a late load possibility. Note that there will be an error created if an item unloads during the effect period of the item transmutation. There is no efficient way to avoid this other than not unloading items when the race is actively in use (not a major issue in real world conditions)

[ZERO]

All abilities now have correct coloring in chat.

[ZERO]

Fixed exploit where you could get yourself unfrozen during a casting by casting your ult or item ability during it and then having the shorter cast time unfreeze you.
Fixed exploit where it was possible to plant & activate Item Transmutation after the round ended and before the round restarted so that a user could potentially nuke the enemy spawn for items right at round start and or cause crashes/glitches.

[Blackmage]

So I don't forget. Killed a Pano to end round with over 100 health. Respawned with 100 and got hit to 50 as per normal. When Pano hit was at 100. Can't recall if this is normal or not, making a note so I can test when I'm awake.

[ZERO]

1.0.0

Initial Release

[ZERO]

Stats link added:
http://www.ibisgaming.com/wcs_stats/player.php?id=106872

[CYBER]

Stats link added:
http://www.ibisgaming.com/wcs_stats/player.php?id=106872
ehm... why is the steam link pointing to an arab guy from emirates ?MMM?

http://steamcommunity.com/id/45645463454524/

[ZERO]

The steam links for all of them do b/c I use the first set of steam numbers for the races. It is next to impossible that someone in the first 100 keys is actually going to play.

[ZERO]

1.0.1


Max health gain limited to 400hp

[CYBER]

this race is walking at LESS than 50% normal speed... like EXTREMELY slow...

i had to go through an extra large double expresso just to get out of spawn....

[Locust]

I agree the race is super fucking slow. Just seems to me with the reduced health and speed its just gonna be food for the fast teleporting races.

[taraN]

It takes a while to stop and get your recoil straight before you can fire straight too. And when you're firing with an automatic weapon your recoil will start getting all messed up again after your second bullet because of the 50% less speed.

Even if you max out this race will the abilities even be useful because your recoil is gonna be kinda trash unless your using a sniper, then you gotta wait 2 seconds after you stop moving for your recoil to be set again.

[Locust]

That's if you even manage to get through all 80 levels without wanting to kill a small child.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think having both half hp and half the movement speed is actually going to work out. You just die way to fast to do anything

[Passarelli]

Zero, did you ever make the armor act as additional HP for this race? Also, the 50% movement might be a bit much. Setting it to 80% or even 90% will still have a major impact, but will make the race easier to play.

The main issue with the low movement speed is that even if you are a T on italy, a CT spiderman, santa, or vagabond can beat you to the house. It just takes tooo long to go anywhere. If you are on the team where you have to do the objective, it is neigh impossible to complete. If it takes about 1 minute to run the hosties back to the rescue zone and 1 minute to get there, that is 4 minutes for an alchemist.

[Locust]

Playing this race just really pisses me off. It doesn't really make sense to me to have a race that's supposed to protect teammates in a game that's relatively fast paced and then make it so that race cannot keep up with anything at all not to mention make it squishy as a mother fucker.

[Passarelli]

Locust, the armor for this race is supposed to also act as additional hp--at least the last time I talked to Zero. 50% is likely a bit much, 90% speed would probably work much better. If adding armor doesn't do so, then that skill really is a waste since no one needs that much armor.

Zero, will this skill also supply a helmet with the armor given?

[Locust]

From what I've experienced from playing it the extra armor does not act as HP. I was able to be 1 knifed from 50 hp and 50 armor.

[ZERO]

Note that only the abilities of recently reprogrammed races will be taking the armor into account. The other races are still dealing dmg directly to health.

[Passarelli]

Knives typically bypass armor anyway. You'd have to test it with a normal gun. Get shot with a pistol in the dome when you have full armor and see if you die and how much damage it dealt. You are looking to see if you die with 50>99 dmg.

Zero, all races are getting the armor as hp buff? Does it only apply to armor >125 or something?

[ZERO]

No, it applies to the dmg from abilities. Currently races that have not been updated deal their dmg directly to a clients health with no regard for armor. Thus armor only reduced bullet dmg from guns. The races that have been updated deal their dmg more like guns and take into account the armor of clients when dealing gmd and thus do not deal dmg only to health.

[Passarelli]

If abilities use the same basic formula for damage reduction as guns, armor is still a waste above 60 armor :/

I was mistaken and thought armor for the alchemist would act as additional hp O.o

[ZERO]

Note how the ult for alchemist is dealing dmg it uses the new method.

[Passarelli]

Zero, even if you use a glock and shoot someone in the legs, it is only going to use like 60 armor total before they die. That's what I meant about it being a waste.

[What]

Why you no log on steam Pass?

[Passarelli]

Haven't had an outlet to plug in my laptop, and steam doesn't have an app for the shitty windows mobile os.

[What]

Are you a Dickensian street urchin now?

[Passarelli]

If you wish hard enough, it still wouldn't happen. I'm not allowed to have an inverter in the truck.

[ZERO]

Why!? lol

[Passarelli]

Because it isn't my truck and they don't want to have to call roadside assistance to give me a jump. I have a solution in the works, but I'll have to work for a while before I have the money to implement it. More important things, sadly enough.

[ZERO]

Just for reference you can just use it only while the truck is running and thus it does not drain the battery.

[brett friggin favre]

soooo i just hopped into wcs to see what was going on, see if any of the changes were working, that kind of thing. they were on assault, ct side. i spawn. 5 seconds later "scorched earth sets you ablaze for 20 seconds". i think wow, ok, that sounds a little OP but whatever.

as soon as that wears off, "scorched earth sets you ablaze for 14.3 seconds". well...i guess i'm dead. i'll just get a lace next round.

i buy a lace.

10 seconds later "scorched earth sets you ablaze for 20 seconds"

and i left.

you wanna make it easier for new players to join? this race ain't it. it can just fuck right off.

[CYBER]

Burning in wcs is the worst thing that can happen to u after bash.
No vision bcos of particles.
No audio.
No footsteps sounds specifically.
Choppy slow movement, hard to aim and turn.
COMPLETELY fucks with the core of any invisible race...


Anddddddddd it's on a 100 uptime with 2 alchemists Anddddddddd it can't be blocked by lace whatsoever...


Zero I will be the blunt cunt that everyone refuses to be : alchemist was the single biggest mistake you've ever programmed recently. Especially when the server is dead.
U cant level it. U cant play it. U cant play against it... There is no fun with alchemist around.

I'd rather face 100 bloodmages than 2 alchemists camping their fucking asses off...


Rly zero. Wcs went from a Fun server to a try hard dull camping server...
If I wanted camping and never-ending anal burning, I would go into the forest with Phil's abusive papi...

[ZERO]

I am going to need to restrect this race but I do also plan to adjust it's speed a bit.

[ZERO]

1.0.2


Max health gain is now actually limited to 400hp
Increased speed to 60%

[Passarelli]

Zero, when I was testing this race, I was really impressed the the kit as a whole. Now that it has the movement speed reduction and how the ultimate goes through laces, I no longer do. I haven't seen a single alchemist do anything but camp and use it's ultimate. I haven't gotten warded to take away items or anything. I think a fair trade would be to remove the speed reduction and allow laces to stop the ult. I had thought the whole point of the race was to give them something to remove items so that their opponents would be more vulnerable--not just to bypass that all together.

[Passarelli]

Zero, this race still isn't restricted to 1 per team. Having 2 at a time is pretty crazy.

- - - Updated - - -

Also, a better solution than having a lace block it's ultimate--an item that prevents you from catching on fire?

[Locust]

Alchemist the anti fun race...
Just one person playing it forces you to change how you play because you're on a timer cause in 30 seconds you're gonna be burning for 20 and then the other team has a huge advantage due to it. It completely takes away different styles of play. You can't actually take it slow to try and actually tactically do objectives if you're the last person on your team because you're on the burn timer for the alch. It forces you to rush and try to kill the alch before they're able to get their ult off. WHen it's maxed it does 80 fucking damage while slowing and restricting sound and movement speed. The ult needs to be changed for it to be something that's fun to play with. It's a great concept but the ult is a goddamn massive piece of bull shit

[Masskid]

On top of the ult making people rush the alchemist, you usually find them camping with shadow hunter + other alchemists. This makes maps like assualt, italy, and office on t side way to unbalanced. In order to counter the combo you need to be able to rush in to stop the alchemist ultimate which ends up with you getting caught in laces + shadow hunter wards + like 5-6 people around you... basicly you cant do shit because if you try to move slow you take shit tons of alchemist dmg and/or get raped by those spidermen/jack that like to chill on the team, if you rush in you get gang banged.

Now you might say Oh just stryder eagle bomb drop them but that only handles the alchemist. But since they camp with shadow hunters they just sit in their tiny room with 300+ hp and last time i checked 3 stryders don't win against 3 shadow hunters.

[Wolfenstinger]

I'd like to state that as a vagalion player... I don't do my objective anymore if I'm burning for 40 seconds because I'm too busy buying kevlar to stay alive. Yes... 40 seconds. Two alchemists actually coordinated how to use their ults to where everyone dies within the next ult, regardless of buying kevlar or not.

[ZERO]

1.0.3


Users with ult immunity have 50% chance to evade ult dmg on each dmg hit.

[ZERO]

1.0.4


Users with ult immunity have 50% chance to evade the ult on casting.

[Masskid]

So please tell me zero, How do you counter 3 alchemist, 2 shadow hunters, + various other races on Italy?

[CYBER]

Zero. Look at the feedback on this race compared to any race you released.
This is one of the most anti-fun races released.

the ONLY solution to this race right now is to make the Lace = 100% immunity from its ult. not 50%, not 75% . 100. There NEEDS to be CONSISTENCY. we NEED to know that we invest in a 3500 item, that it would work, and not rely on RNG...
And remove it's slow. or force a Para weight on it to slow it down. like you can do with the awp to scout on vaga.

Not to mention that stacking alchemists with ult after ult after ult after ult effectively renders your lace immunity to (50% ^number of alchemists )^ number of times the ult is used = very useless lace.

================================================== =======

the race has a BUILT IN ITEM REMOVING WARD. which is NEVER used. i have YET to see any alchemist actually do anything EXCEPT camp and spam ult on top of objectives... have an alchemist cast ult a second before bomb is being planted? GOOD LUCK DEFUSING.


Let the damn alchemist use its ward to actually time it while its scorched earth is live.... let their anti-item ward prioritize the lace removal for that duration of time. but we talked about this on many races before. the lace should be the mother of all uncontested items. Nothing should go through it unless it gets removed. period.

But right now, this race is being babysat hard and breaking the game as we know it.

[Wolfenstinger]

The only thing i've ever seen that item removing ward used for.... was to spot a vaga. Never have I ever seen it used to actually physically remove any items (I mean it removes items... yes.... but when it's a vaga... they pack light... How light? Real light. Usually a lace.... some health pots...maybe a couple biscuits for the road..)

[Devilbear]

The 50% is a start, but it's not nearly enough.
On Italy, Crackhouse, Militia, Assault (worst one) and even Office, a good alchemist duo and shadow hunters defending them will shut down the entire enemy team and give them barely any chance unless all of them go op races, and this also mainly happens on T side on all those maps which is usually what people stack just to make it worse.
It's not fun being on fire the whole round even if you can evade 50% of the time now, with 2 or more alchemists you can even double cast and get the people who evaded the first one.
This always leads to people leaving on the other team, which is not good for the server. So either make lace guaranteed, or balance it in some other way, cause this is hurting the server.

[Passarelli]

Zero, if you really want to keep the ult going through laces (which is redundant because of the ward) then at least put in the flame retardant item. Make it the same price as an anti-ward and last 1 round.

[minjae]

I just recently started playing, and while it is very fun, I only have three races almost maxed out. Human, undead, and hell hunter.
Only races I extremely HATE are vagas and alchemists. There were 4 people playing. Two of the T's were alchemists on de_crackhouse........

Vagas I can deal with, but the fire...OH THE FIRE.. I just can't...

[rawrr]

i tried to help you the best i could minj!! We did pretty good though.

[ZERO]

1.0.5


Increased speed to 70%
Alll users with ult immunity are immune to ult.

[Passarelli]

Huzzah! Thanks zero! Now the ward will actually be used.

[CYBER]

1.0.5


Increased speed to 70%
Alll users with ult immunity are immune to ult.


thank sweet baby jesus!


also side note zero, when someone is casting the alc ult, i get HUUUUGE frame drops. is there a way to fix that on either end?

[minjae]

i tried to help you the best i could minj!! We did pretty good though.

Yeah I know rawr..thanks!! They did change their races though. Made it easier.


But another note. Are there races that have ult immunity? orrr is it the lace? So confused..

[rawrr]

its the lace, but Athena occasionally spawns with a lace.

[minjae]

Oh yeah..just found it. Duh..I was looking through the items.

[Wolfenstinger]

But another note. Are there races that have ult immunity? orrr is it the lace? So confused..

Warden, Athena, Shadow of the Void

All three of those races can spawn with a lace. However, Shadow of the Void can purchase a lace on his own (if I recall; idk if that is unintended or what the case may be) BUT I KNOW THE OTHER TWO CAN'T so... Yeah. Anyone else can buy a lace pretty much.

[rawrr]

Warden, Athena, Shadow of the Void

All three of those races can spawn with a lace. However, Shadow of the Void can purchase a lace on his own (if I recall; idk if that is unintended or what the case may be) BUT I KNOW THE OTHER TWO CAN'T so... Yeah. Anyone else can buy a lace pretty much.

Yeah that ^

[CYBER]

Zero? Changing the color of a sprite shouldn't be a big deal right?

Can u make it so that the alchemist ultimate activates on terrorist is red and the one activated on CT is blue for consistency and visual differentiation?

Because I sometimes find myself in an alchemist ult being activated and I can't tell if I should gtfo asap or if it is done by my own teammate somewhere?

Thanks.

[rawrr]

This would be very helpful! ^ :wtg:

[ZERO]

Zero? Changing the color of a sprite shouldn't be a big deal right?

Can u make it so that the alchemist ultimate activates on terrorist is red and the one activated on CT is blue for consistency and visual differentiation?

Because I sometimes find myself in an alchemist ult being activated and I can't tell if I should gtfo asap or if it is done by my own teammate somewhere?

Thanks.

That is actually a series of custom sprites that with with eachother. Each hundreds of MB in size uncompressed. Each one then contains individual animation frames. It could be done but would add about 20MB to user downloads when connecting to the wcs server and take about a week or so to program the changes and actually make the sprites and get them to compile within the size limits again.

[CYBER]

That is actually a series of custom sprites that with with eachother. Each hundreds of MB in size uncompressed. Each one then contains individual animation frames. It could be done but would add about 20MB to user downloads when connecting to the wcs server and take about a week or so to program the changes and actually make the sprites and get them to compile within the size limits again.



can u provide the sprites in some zip file to take a look at?
I've been meaning to try to work on some sprites, and a "re-color project" couild be a gd first step.


as for the download, i don't think it has to be done all in 1 shot no?
progressive download over time? takes about 8 levels nway to get the ult
but nway, that is something that could help lessen the confusion when an ult is being activated....

that's why i usually hate when red/blue colors are used for skins or vague animations (beast and santa color schemes being annoying as fuck too when on CTs lol) but nway.

[Passarelli]

The problem with them not downloading them right away is that someone else will use the ability when they join the server.

I do like this idea though, and frankly don't see a 20 MB extra download as too trying, considering today's internet speeds. Even on shitty century link with a 4 Mb/s speed, that would only add 40 seconds of download time, and it should only be a one time thing.

[ZERO]

The easiest thing to do would be to change the color of the animated beacon rings b/c that is 100% code.

[CYBER]

The easiest thing to do would be to change the color of the animated beacon rings b/c that is 100% code.

Baby steps zero, that could be a first step to see if it helps. But i do think this should be a must to differentiate.

And hopefully any other effects down the road either don't use red and blue, or have this feature available at worst case :)

- - - Updated - - -


The problem with them not downloading them right away is that someone else will use the ability when they join the server.

I do like this idea though, and frankly don't see a 20 MB extra download as too trying, considering today's internet speeds. Even on shitty century link with a 4 Mb/s speed, that would only add 40 seconds of download time, and it should only be a one time thing.

I've waited a lot like longer every time I joined a zombie mod and their insanely large maps or going into gmod games...

20mb isn't that much these days, if someone can help u zero with the sprite colouring let us know and he'll we can even use the temporary beacon recolonization in code IF they don't have the sprites downloaded (if wanting to use progressive downloads)

[CYBER]

I'ma necro an ENTIRE sub-forums that's been inactive for more than 7 months :/

Zero. THIS RACE right here was one of the main reasons the server died out :/

side note: GOD i miss seeing my sig.

[StarsMine]

Main reason is CSS itself is dead.