WCS Rules

[maynard]

nade spamming objectives is not allowed. the enemy team must always have an open route for their objective. blocking all the paths with wards or any form of nade is not allowed.

[Masskid]

it was on office cyber, both doors were blocked, one with fire nade and one with smoke nade so it was virtually impossible to get in without dmg

[StarsMine]

takes luck to block a door with fire.

[Chikun]

takes luck to block a door with fire.

:huh: No?

[Masskid]

takes luck to block a door with fire.
not when its thrown directly in the door way >.>

[StarsMine]

The fire ward has a very small radius, You can almost always walk right around it. I really dont see it as anything but a deterrent. Damage is really minimal.

[Masskid]

nade spamming objectives is not allowed. the enemy team must always have an open route for their objective. blocking all the paths with wards or any form of nade is not allowed.
must have missed this, thank you maynard for the update. Also could you update rule 5 to state that hell hunter's nades cannot block all passage ways?

[CYBER]

must have missed this, thank you maynard for the update. Also could you update rule 5 to state that hell hunter's nades cannot block all passage ways?

here;s the thing though, as far as i remember, the rule was clearly not to SPAM the bomb, bombsite, hostages with nades. as in, u can only nade the objective once ONLY.
if you word the rule 5 to state that hell hunter nades cannot block all passages to objective, then this would mean that you cant even throw ONE grenade at objective, bcos it will be above it, and blocking all sides right??


this is why i said above that you should "technically" be able to block all entrances to bombsite or wtvr with ONE grenade at each door at most... bcos its not hard to walk through ONE smoke grenade per door... seriously... but apparently maynard seems to state other than what i've understood all along....
so i guess we need him to update rule 5 to properly explain that shit

[Masskid]

Maybe we need a whole new rule for it?? Instead of just an edit idk :/

[maynard]

5. Wards are not allowed to fully block an objective. There must be a clear path for the opposing team to take towards their objective at all times. Warding rooms that contain hostages is not allowed, however, if a shadow hunter is summoned to the objective, the shadow hunter does reserve the right to drop his wards. This rule applies too strider as well.


"blocking" a path means if the person takes that path, they will receive damage. blocking all paths towards an objective is not allowed, nor ever has been.

[maynard]

"There must be a clear path for the opposing team to take towards their objective at all times."

added as a new rule. separated from rule 5 to prevent any confusion.

[Blackmage]

And so we don't get "he said, she said", as it's become a thing again, suicide to deny is currently a no-no, correct? Yes, I asked you and yes I'm making a giant leap that the people who need to will read this, but, alas. Want it in writing, as currently, the two stances we have are "it's fine" and later "don't abuse it".

Also, rule 12, does that apply for wards/damaging things/blocking things or is it a suggestion for summoning too? Alternatively, in Rule 1, stuck, does it apply to only being inside walls, or does that include areas where you cannot reach the objective.

[Erdenay]

And so we don't get "he said, she said", as it's become a thing again, suicide to deny is currently a no-no, correct? Yes, I asked you and yes I'm making a giant leap that the people who need to will read this, but, alas. Want it in writing, as currently, the two stances we have are "it's fine" and later "don't abuse it".

Also, rule 12, does that apply for wards/damaging things/blocking things or is it a suggestion for summoning too? Alternatively, in Rule 1, stuck, does it apply to only being inside walls, or does that include areas where you cannot reach the objective.

I second this - I've also asked maynard before to put that rule in stone just so we'd end all of this once and for all.

[DJ_MikeyRevile]

2) Taking advantage of the shortcomings of valve
3) Taking advantage of a mod
A) When used to break the normal functionality of the game
a) Such as wards or poison smoke being used on bombs and hostages

XII. Spec/Retry
1) No player shall enter spectate to avoid death.
2) No player shall reconnect or leave the server and come back to avoid death.
3) No player shall reconnect or leave the server and come back to play again in the same round.
4) Above applies to all servers for all players, should not be confused with allowing zombies to teleport to avoid death.

All of this can be found in the server general rules.
I hope this answers your question about using the kill command to avoid death by the enemy, avoid doing the objective, or any other reason to avoid doom.

Ill explain how it is used as an exploit.

Player A is a a vagalion

Player B is a Human

Player B has a lace

Player A gets stuck by lace

Player A executes the Kill command to prevent Player B from getting experience or to simply troll Player B.

Player B says fuck that!

Player A lawls

DJ Mikey tells player A he is a faggot and to not exploit the short coming of valve, to not use a command that breaks the normal functionality of the game, ect.

Player A cries like a baby.


Edit: ill even agrue that the same can be said about players who use the kill command just to buy more tomes.

[Blackmage]

One problem lies in the fact that the "kill" command is NOT a shortcoming. It is a command that has high strategic value, in any gamemode where it is allowed, if used correctly. It can deny money, deny kills count, stop objective completion bonuses. It is a normal gameplay tactic, just with more incentive here.

It's also not clearly referenced anywhere, which is what I'm trying to fix. Currently it just exists as side notes.

Not really sure how "XII. Spec/Retry" applies. First off, the kill command is neither going to spectate or rejoining the server. Also, going spectate doesn't avoid death, at least in WCS. Related: death does not: Avoid death or let you play twice. If you read it "using any method to avoid being killed by another player", then I can see. But if that's the case, then we still have this clarity issue that I'm trying to bring to light.

WCS also has need of related, but different rule, which is why rules such as:

1) Taking advantage of the shortcomings of a map
A) Using methods not intended by the map creator to gain an advantage where it is 99%+ impossible for zombies to get you
B) Camping in areas that you can only get to by exploiting a map or using special zombie powers to get to the end of an escape map

Don't apply to us and we have rule 3 instead.

On your edit, the recent ruling that while you disagree with, you also should know about. Here for the curious. (http://www.ibisgaming.com/forums/showthread.php/9599-question-as-to-rule-on-something) Going to spectate to buy tomes is allowed. So a normal gameplay element is granted additional functionality in WCS. Killing yourself to get more tomes, at least I'd qualify them as similar. Same for "kill" to remove kits from Vagas.

[DJ_MikeyRevile]

One problem lies in the fact that the "kill" command is NOT a shortcoming. It is a command that has high strategic value, in any gamemode where it is allowed, if used correctly. It can deny money, deny kills count, stop objective completion bonuses.


All of those things contradict the rules in place specifically for this mod.

[brett friggin favre]

Using the kill command should only be done if two invis races are stuck and are the last two alive. The one ego should use it is determined by the type of map: t on de_ maps, CT on cs_ maps. Not doing so is in essence excessive camping. Using kill to deny someone a kill is against the rules in my book. It's like you're losing in checkers and you just throw the board across the room. It's very poor sportsmanship, and shouldn't be encouraged.

[CYBER]

Yes, denying xp by suicide should not be allowed, specially a vaga that was stuck by a lace by a NON-frozen race (not vagas or rap)... even if its gonna take him the entire fucking round time to find that invis vaga, u cant just go kill urself and deny the guy the xp. but if two stuck races are left only, like brett said, T suicides for de_maps and CT suicides for cs_maps, bcos thats how the round will announce it if they dnt do obj.


as for the rest, This is my opinion and my opinion only: typing kill after 8+ rounds or whatever to buy tomes, because you reached 16k, have already 3 shopmenu items and 5 tomes should be perfectly fine. You're losing ~9k worth of shop items to do so...
People dont usually kill themselves at that point if they didnt think 'hmm i cant spend my EARNED money on anything?!" ... Not to mention that the the KILL command fucks your kdr, and our community mostly gives a fuck about stats...

The same goes for vagas or neb and raps killing themselves at round end to get rid of a kit, with all due respect but zero should have implemented a 'Drop kit/bomb feature for all invis races on their +ability keys... Currently T vagas have an edge over ct vagas when it comes down to being flagged by a floating object.

If zero isnt going to implement this patch to BALANCE both teams of invis races, then personally me i will fucking kill myself every time i randomly pick up a fucking kit dropped by an idiot teammate who decided to die through double doors or on bomb etc... Its not easy spotting a kit on ground when teleporting to that spot 100 ft away>_< ...

im willing to play out the round WITH the kit, so that i do my objective and not deny someone xp in spotting/killing me, but after round end, the only person im harming with a suicide is myself, to get rid of that kit.

[Chef C Green]

[COLOR=#ff0000]The same goes for vagas or neb and raps killing themselves at round end to get rid of a kit, with all due respect but zero should have implemented a 'Drop kit/bomb feature for all invis races on their +ability keys... Currently T vagas have an edge over ct vagas when it comes down to being flagged by a floating object.

If zero isnt going to implement this patch to BALANCE both teams of invis races, then personally me i will fucking kill myself every time i randomly pick up a fucking kit dropped by an idiot teammate who decided to die through double doors or on bomb etc... Its not easy spotting a kit on ground when teleporting to that spot 100 ft away>_< ...

im willing to play out the round WITH the kit, so that i do my objective and not deny someone xp in spotting/killing me, but after round end, the only person im harming with a suicide is myself, to get rid of that kit.

+1 Agree that this should have no affect on gameplay. Even more though, I really like the idea of a +ability for Vaga's seeing as the function is not being used for anything at the moment. To keep it still more challenging, what if a new set of levels was added for +ability (call it "Stalker" or something) where you get 3-15 seconds where ALL items (bomb + kit) are also invisible. Gives vaga's time to plant without being seen (hopefully getting those players who just use those races for kills to actually do their objective), or defuse.

@Cyber, you should post your idea on the race suggestion thread, would like to see that aspect balanced more as you said.

[Blackmage]

All of those things contradict the rules in place specifically for this mod.


if your stuck and can't do anything and are the last person 2 do the objective, then you should type kill in console and kill yourself. CS is team based. if you can't complete the objective cause your stuck then off yourself, don't make every 1 wait for you cause you don't want 1 more death on your record.


it's not officially against the rules... no one has ever punished for this as the person killing himself is just destroying his score, and is not benefiting in any ways from it... people doing it once in a while has never been an issue.

Problem is we have rulings such as that first one found here (http://www.ibisgaming.com/forums/showthread.php/2240-WCS-Rules?p=55238#post55238). Second ruling here. (http://www.ibisgaming.com/forums/showthread.php/2240-WCS-Rules?p=128324#post128324) Also, ruling such as the popular "glitching flight races was allowed" which ALSO goes against our rules, but was ruled to be allowed. Our rules are not the most consistent or clear.

Yes, this is against the rules, I just want it in writing by an official source. We also have the issue we're not supposed to make up our own rules, so the best way to combat that is ALSO having it written.

Edit: and technically it's going with the rules. If you are stuck, you cannot complete(respect) your objective, and therefore SHOULD kill yourself.

[StarsMine]

alright, a hell hunter plants the bomb and then cooks a smoke grenade so when he get killed the site gets smoked (compleatly on purpse)

Now im saying its against the rules as it counts as warding the bomb site, they say it isnt as its not spamming it with nades :/

[Masskid]

alright, a hell hunter plants the bomb and then cooks a smoke grenade so when he get killed the site gets smoked (compleatly on purpse)

Now im saying its against the rules as it counts as warding the bomb site, they say it isnt as its not spamming it with nades :/

9. No fire-nade or poison-smoke nade spamming the objective.

12. There must be a clear path for the opposing team to take towards their objective at all times.

.... which one :\???

because its not breaking rule 9 but it is breaking 12 :\

[Blackmage]

If they're cooking it and standing there to try and get around not throwing it, it's abuse anyway, but I digress. The way I read it, you can nade the objective (as in area) but not block the actual objective.

[StarsMine]

Thats what I thought and told the server.

[Spasm]

Should go back to the way it used to be. No fire nades smoke nades on the objective, treated like wards, its much easier to enforce and makes more sense.

[StarsMine]

im not going to get a ruling on this from clan am I...

[blackmail242]

So just to clarify something: For races such as eye of rah, is there a set time by which they should switch from a back of the group mentallity to doing the objective actively? I thought it was set that everyone should start gunning for the objective by no later than 1:30 however have yet to find a post stating as such.

[Chikun]

I thought it was set that everyone should start gunning for the objective by no later than 1:30 however have yet to find a post stating as such.

That's because no such post exists. If it takes people a while to do the objective fine, but when the round ends because the timer hit zero there's problems.

[lychee]

That's because no such post exists. If it takes people a while to do the objective fine, but when the round ends because the timer hit zero there's problems.

Usually, nothing happens. I am calling out people on this, some people camp in the being like for a minute then they start to move(walking pace) and pretend to do objective, but are just trying to stay alive and kill enemies. The round ends and objective is not completed as nothing happens because they have "attempted".. I do not want to call out names, so I think rounds should either be shorten or the objective should be started by 1:30(in other words, start moving your ass) which gives them enough time to attempt the objective.

[Steamer]

Camping is NOT allowed on WCS server. See rule 4. The objective rule answers itself.... When something isn't allowed, there generally is no time limit for that...

Sure people camp for little, its strategic, but you all know what excessive is.

As for the fire and poison nade on objective that is allowed without spam, well yes, it does indeed break rule 12 technically.

[CYBER]

So just to clarify something: For races such as eye of rah, is there a set time by which they should switch from a back of the group mentallity to doing the objective actively? I thought it was set that everyone should start gunning for the objective by no later than 1:30 however have yet to find a post stating as such.

If i hear anyone mentionning the 1:30 'rule' again, im going to bitchslap them... This RULE was created by in game cry bAby regulars who kelt sayin 'these hosties need a minute to Walk straight to safe zone uninterrupted, i need 30seconds to get them and possibly protect them, so fuck off, im camping"....

Look, excessive camping that DELAYS the objective is not allowed, there is no TIME limit for it, it just is. I played eyerae a lottttt, and i usUally camped out the first 2 summons (total 40 seconds?) . Say on aztec, my teammate has the bomb, protected by others, going to B to plant.

I would tke the back end sewers, summon 2 ppl to kill, Nd keep walking to B. i am not holding off the objective bcos my teammate is doing so, im Actually helping him by kling enemies then move to bombsite.

Now, if my allies died, and im the only one left to get the bomb, i BETTER be doing the objective as priority, summoning if safe as second option. But now me camping would delay the round..

It doesnt take a genius to tell u to check TAB often...But there is no time limit, MY personal tAke on this is that as long as the objective is being completed by someone, and u are trying to kill ppl or assist, and not afk, then i dnt care what u do. But if the objective is affected by u camping, then it is excessive and i dnt like that.

[Blackmage]

For anyone curious, a little pre-"written rules" (by a day) discussion including camping rules: here (http://www.ibisgaming.com/forums/showthread.php/2238-WCS-rules-questions?highlight=skywalk%2A)

Ok, so I was questioning the rules before they existed! And, I'm mentioning the "1 minute rule" that was suggested in there.... Only because it's not the one Cyber doesn't want to hear about!

[blackmail242]

I apologize for this the only reason I brought it up is because this was one of those "rules" that even I thought really did exist. Also this post: http://www.ibisgaming.com/forums/showthread.php/2240-WCS-Rules?p=56821#post56821 is confusing even more so because it states that unless he is the last one alive and his teamate is not "doing the objective" then he is not required to stop camping

[Blackmage]

IMO, what that's saying is, as long as the objective is being completed, you can do what you need to support your team. Respect the objective does not mean everyone needs to be rushing for it. It means it needs to be completed. However, you ARE supporting your team by pulling enemies out of position. It also says that if there are only a few left, you DO need to stop camping.

As long as the objective can reasonably be completed without you, you can continue to support the team from the back. Once every man is needed, get a move on, do what needs to be done.

[StarsMine]

I still never got a clear answer to my question.

And yea, if your not heading to the objective or being an asset to getting the objective done by 1:00, your a useless teammate. If everyone is dead and your still sitting in the same spot or running circles in the same area, Im going to be annoyed.

[maynard]

regarding the objective time limit... it really comes down 2 the person... everyone is responsible for making sure they do their part... if you drag your ass, and don't get 2 the objective in time, well that will be seen as you not doing the objective... depending on the race you're playing, you should know how long it will take you 2 get where you need 2 be.

if there's only a couple people left on your team, you should be helping them as best you can, not hanging back and trying 2 just get some kills with eye ra.

completing the objective must always be respected and attempted.



regarding the nade on objectives.. not sure what's so hard 2 understand about this? the rules clearly state that a clear path must be available 2 the opposing team for the objective at all times... I can easily throw a fire nade on a bombsite, and it still have more than enough room for a CT 2 come and defuse the bomb... a poison smoke nade is a diff matter as it's a far bigger damage radius... each person needs 2 make a judgement that if where they throw whatever it is they are throwing, that it wont conflict with the existing rules.

If you guys really want, we could always just say no special nades, or regular nade spamming on the objectives... I know originally that is how we had it.. over time it did end up changing.. not sure how or when... but the way it stands now, if people are smart, and read the rules... they really shouldn't have an issue.

[blackmail242]

The issue we have is basically the hell hunterclass on dust2 on bombsite B. He can sit up there in the skybox above it drop a poison nade on the hallway a fire one on the double doors and then lay fire down on the third entrance with his ulti. Thats if they play fair.

If not then they just throw a fucken nade no matter what type on the bomb or relatively close and just sit there waiting to here hurt to unleash the hell that is their ultimate

[StarsMine]

So next time I see a hell hunter cook a smoke after planting a bomb for the sole reason of droping it when they get shot will get a nice boot in their ass :smirk:

[HypeRNT]

Blackmail i know you aren't suggesting that Hell hunter is OP in some way on dust 2? I don't care how many smokes he throws or what he does, the class is perfectly balanced and fun to play and should be left alone.

On the objective rule, i have never seen any punishment whats so ever about people camping or being useless. Not once have i seen some1 being slayed the next round for making all the people watch fail teammates not doing their objectives and wasting every1s time. There should be a rule of some sorts were at a certain time like 1 minute mark you should be moving to the objective and trying to attempt it. If its a bomb map, you can take your time because it only takes a few seconds to plant the bomb, but if its a hostie map, it takes a long time to get the hosties to the rescue zone and that's were i would love to see more punishment.

I also understand that sometimes you just have to do a safe round were you don't have enough money so you are trying to keep your gun, but too many times i see people playing vaga's and just teleporting around the map with their head up their ass and not doing shit, for times like those, i really wish they would get slain the ROUND AFTER so they would be forced to watch every1 play for the entire round like we had to watch him play and do nothing the previous round.

[Chikun]

I also understand that sometimes you just have to do a safe round were you don't have enough money so you are trying to keep your gun, but too many times i see people playing vaga's and just teleporting around the map with their head up their ass and not doing shit, for times like those, i really wish they would get slain the ROUND AFTER so they would be forced to watch every1 play for the entire round like we had to watch him play and do nothing the previous round.

That would need to be handled very delicately or it would be like blowing up Hoover Dam and unleashing a lake of salty tears onto the abuse section of the forums.

[Erdenay]

On the objective rule, i have never seen any punishment whats so ever about people camping or being useless. Not once have i seen some1 being slayed the next round for making all the people watch fail teammates not doing their objectives and wasting every1s time. There should be a rule of some sorts were at a certain time like 1 minute mark you should be moving to the objective and trying to attempt it. If its a bomb map, you can take your time because it only takes a few seconds to plant the bomb, but if its a hostie map, it takes a long time to get the hosties to the rescue zone and that's were i would love to see more punishment.

I also understand that sometimes you just have to do a safe round were you don't have enough money so you are trying to keep your gun, but too many times i see people playing vaga's and just teleporting around the map with their head up their ass and not doing shit, for times like those, i really wish they would get slain the ROUND AFTER so they would be forced to watch every1 play for the entire round like we had to watch him play and do nothing the previous round.

That means you either haven't played with me enough or didn't pay attention

[Wolfenstinger]

This is on Wards (Shadow Hunter / Strider's) and people's opinion on Hostage Rescue Zones. Something I wanted to get cleared up after playing cs_crackhouse earlier.

I know most Hostage Rescue Zones (HRZ for sake of this) are CT spawn related and what not, but is it really considered warding the objective if the hostages are still staying put in their original location?
Ex. cs_italy, T vaga teles long route to get to CT spawn and always lands at gate with the lamp post. CT shadow hunter sets wards there knowing this - is he in the wrong?
And
Ex. cs_crackhouse, CT shadowhunter camps warehouse corner (entering from start of game, take left corner), which is closest to HRZ. Is he wrong for warding there to get people on outside??

[CYBER]

This is on Wards (Shadow Hunter / Strider's) and people's opinion on Hostage Rescue Zones. Something I wanted to get cleared up after playing cs_crackhouse earlier.

I know most Hostage Rescue Zones (HRZ for sake of this) are CT spawn related and what not, but is it really considered warding the objective if the hostages are still staying put in their original location?
Ex. cs_italy, T vaga teles long route to get to CT spawn and always lands at gate with the lamp post. CT shadow hunter sets wards there knowing this - is he in the wrong?
And
Ex. cs_crackhouse, CT shadowhunter camps warehouse corner (entering from start of game, take left corner), which is closest to HRZ. Is he wrong for warding there to get people on outside??

the same issue arises in office for example. and maps that have many hostage rescue zones.
Many people say that "well i warded one of the rescue zones, but there is ANOTHER hostie zone to take the hosties to, so technically speaking i am not "blocking the objective" since the CTs can still take them around the wards to the other hosties rescue zone.
The same goes for bombsites. Someone said that "well the bomb is ALREADY planted at A, why cant i bomb B? its not interfering with the objective!...
or The bomb is DROPPED, i could ward a bombsite if i want to because someone is camping the bomb, by the time someone picks it up and choses a bombsite, the wards either faded or they can go to other bombsite...
There is also people bitching about a shadow hunter running with hosties following him, and drops a ward at the market entrance AFTER him (and hosties run through that ward )towards rescue zone on italy, basically disallowing the T to follow him down that path and they are forced to go around the map to make it...

i mean these are all "exceptional cases" that ppl keep questioning, along with your suggestions. and usually we take them case by case.

now to answer u based on what "I" know, do not take this as a final answer until maynard confirms or denies this but:
The most important rule is to be able to complete the objective, i WISH that we could "partially" ward a hostie zone at that corner as long as the hosties have a clear path to be rescued. So if u warded the gate, there is still place to run with hosties inside the rescue zone. same on crackhouse, same for bombsites as long as the wards dnt touch the bomb itself and there is enough place to both plant/defuse the bombsite..

if such ward happened i wouldnt go ape-nuts banning people for it, because its a gray area, what i can tell you is that , based on our rules and to SIMPLIFY these technicalities, we can say that you CANT have a ward TOUCH any rescue or bombsite, regardless of where they are. That would solve a all problems, and this is what you should go by until maynard shows up ..

BUT to be fair, and i am pushing for this because i have accidentally done it myself: "technically speaking maynard" the rules say to not block COMPLETELY the "OBJECTIVE" with a ward.
the key problem is definining the word OBJECTIVE: is it the bombsite/rescue zone itself? or the team MISSION?

the following is MY opinion and wish: you should be "technically" ABLE to ward a rescue zone /bombsite (partially, on the side, if there is only one of them, as long as there is a path INSIDE it to rescue hosties or plant/defuse) AND you should be able to ward completely a rescue zone or bombsite if there is TWO+ of them, as long as the bomb/hosties arent already there and get hit by wards, bceause the other team can go plant and save hosties on the other one.

but this is my opinion,
tl;dr : until maynard shows up, read only the paragraph with yellow text.

[maynard]

ill be doing a re-vamp on the rules in the coming weeks, where rules will be extended and go into more detail 2 help clarify things overall and cause less confusion in the end.

some things may flat out change like no more poison smoke or fire nading objectives at all etc... I will most likely be putting up a few threads in the WCS section with a poll so the majority of you can vote, and we can take things where the mass wants them... all though that wouldn't be changing much as originally you weren't allowed 2.

if there are any areas you want things more clarified on, or want 2 see exist in the rules (not new rules, just better clarification) please post on this thread stating so.

[XX0wnsXY]

ill be doing a re-vamp on the rules in the coming weeks, where rules will be extended and go into more detail 2 help clarify things overall and cause less confusion in the end.

some things may flat out change like no more poison smoke or fire nading objectives at all etc... I will most likely be putting up a few threads in the WCS section with a poll so the majority of you can vote, and we can take things where the mass wants them... all though that wouldn't be changing much as originally you weren't allowed 2.

if there are any areas you want things more clarified on, or want 2 see exist in the rules (not new rules, just better clarification) please post on this thread stating so.

Thank you, sir!

[CYBER]

I will most likely be putting up a few threads in the WCS section with a poll so the majority of you can vote, and we can take things where the mass wants them...

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/25787610.jpg

Good luck maynard:P and thanks.

edit: damnit, i forgot Haxor and blackmage -.- <3

[Blackmage]

Challenge accepted!

Rule 1: Clarify what "stuck" means.

Rule 2: ruling about blocking doors, or just spawning too many entities?

Rule 3: make clear what skywalking is and is not. Generally, what you saw in the recent thread.

Rule 4: clarify based upon recent discussion. Including rulings on suicide and generally being stuck.

Rule 5: summoned "via eye ra". Would think this would be obvious to people, but alas.

Rule 10: "class that self produces". Does this mean "spawns with", or is it future prevention. The only thing that self-produces is an item.

This is what I can think ATM. Will update if/when I think of more :)

[maynard]

Rule 1: Clarify what "stuck" means.

stuck means you're infused with the enviorment... and there is no way 2 get out of it.. sometimes if an admin slaps you enough, you can get out of it... but in most cases, you're stuck in that spot for the round unless you slay yourself... it's really nothing more than a glitch.



Rule 3: make clear what skywalking is and is not. Generally, what you saw in the recent thread.

skywalking means you're in the skybox..... derp? if you need a further explination as 2 what a skybox is, go 2 google, I'm not typing it up.





Rule 5: summoned "via eye ra". Would think this would be obvious to people, but alas.

??????



Rule 2: ruling about blocking doors, or just spawning too many entities?

not sure what you're going on about... rule 2 is "Any class that can spawn weapons Is not allowed to use their weapon spawning ultimate/ability for fellow team members."


Rule 10: "class that self produces". Does this mean "spawns with"

a class that is coded 2 start with nades or multiple nades is self producing them via their coding.. hence why you pay nothing for them and immediately start with them.... you're simply splitting hairs over terminology... if you really find it that confusing.. I can change the wording....


Rule 4: clarify based upon recent discussion. Including rulings on suicide and generally being stuck.

I will add a new rule stating that killing yourself via console is deemed an exploit of the server unless you're stuck in the map/glitched. granted if you find yourself in a glitch and are infused with the map and can't get out of it, a self slay in that situation would be acceptable as it would help not prolong the round.

[Blackmage]

First, let me say, I know what you are trying to say with the rules, you just asked what we wanted clarified. These are the things I saw in a cursory glance at the rules, things that have been, or can be issues.


stuck means you're infused with the enviorment... and there is no way 2 get out of it.. sometimes if an admin slaps you enough, you can get out of it... but in most cases, you're stuck in that spot for the round unless you slay yourself... it's really nothing more than a glitch.

Stuck can also mean unable to get places, aka being summoned in a place you can't do your objective.


skywalking means you're in the skybox..... derp? if you need a further explination as 2 what a skybox is, go 2 google, I'm not typing it up.

The windows in Vegas and the area in Italy can be considered part of the skyboxes. Areas you can't normally access that make the world seem larger or full.


??????

Summoning, calling someone some place against their will. AKA: what panorama does.


not sure what you're going on about... rule 2 is "Any class that can spawn weapons Is not allowed to use their weapon spawning ultimate/ability for fellow team members."

Are we allowed to spawn 3000 scouts with Vagabond if we're alone? Can we spawn them in front of the lower door in Nipperhouse if the bomb is in there for an auto win?


a class that is coded 2 start with nades or multiple nades is self producing them via their coding.. hence why you pay nothing for them and immediately start with them.... you're simply splitting hairs over terminology... if you really find it that confusing.. I can change the wording....

You asked for what we want clarified. Changing it to "spawns with" leaves no confusion with flaming gloves.

[maynard]

-will update the eye ra rule 2 further state how they can't summon into places where a player will become physically stuck in an object or map. as always eye ra can summon 2 death or drop you into a shit place where you can't get out of though... depending on your race.

-the window in vegas is not in the skybox... you can't teleport into a skybox unless you do it via item teleport.... some maps have hotspots where you can sneak through, but vegas is not one of them... and if it does have a hot spot I'm unaware of, that's not it. it's simply a high up window that races with tele or fly can get into.

-rematch is passive. not sure what I could possibly do about it.

-no, you can't spawn 3000 of anything as all you're doing is spamming the server... and if you put a shitload of guns down, people will take them... which would violate the already existing rule. given our server is already incredibly unstable, it's quite obvious that doing that would be nothing more than spamming the server and not allowed.... you've been here 3 years mage... come on man...


You asked for what we want clarified. Changing it to "spawns with" leaves no confusion with flaming gloves.

you seem 2 be the only person who has issue understanding this rule. I asked for people 2 ask for clarification on actual matters... not ones you're just making up as you go along for no reason. honestly, that rule is beyond simple 2 comprehend, not a single person in 3 years has ever had trouble understanding that rule, which means it clearly doesn't need clarification or any more depth added 2 it's wording. also, if you have flaming gloves... what are you doing? your self producing nades...

look at the issues stars and cyber have brought up if you're confused as 2 what it is I'm looking for. I'm not looking for nitpicking on things no one has ever complained about or had any issue understanding.

[Blackmage]

Seriously, are you reading what I say?


-the window in vegas is not in the skybox... you can't teleport into a skybox... some maps have hotspots where you can sneak through, but vegas is not one of them... and if it does have a hot spot I'm unaware of, that's not it. it's simply a high up window that races with tele or fly can get into.

So the ruling is, Skybox is a place you can't teleport/fly into, except with a few possible holes. Noted.


-rematch is passive. not sure what I could possibly do about it.

Like I said, simply add the part about "by Eye Ra". People have claimed Pano is summoning because it takes them from where they are, and have warded sites/spawns because of it.


-no, you can't spawn 3000 of anything as all you're doing is spamming the server... and if you put a shitload of guns down, people will take them... which would violate the already existing rule. given our server is already incredibly unstable, it's quite obvious that doing that would be nothing more than spamming the server and not allowed.... you've been here 3 years mage... come on man...

Let me restate, "if we're alone". If we're alone, or have classes with set weapons, we won't be giving them to teamates so it doesn't go against the current rule.

Also, the problem isn't when it's "nothing more than spamming the server". The problem is when it's "using your ability in such a way that is not against the rules to gain an advantage". This is something that has come up a few times in the recent past, which is why I brought it up. Like you said, and I said, I KNOW WHAT IT MEANS, I'M TRYING TO GET YOU TO CLARIFY THINGS, as you asked people to do.


you seem 2 be the only person who has issue understanding this rule. I asked for people 2 ask for clarification on actual matters... not ones you're just making up as you go along for no reason. honestly, that rule is beyond simple 2 comprehend, not a single person in 3 years has ever had trouble understanding that rule, which means it clearly doesn't need clarification or any more depth added 2 it's wording. also, if you have flaming gloves... what are you doing? your self producing nades...

Just because you don't see something doesn't mean it's true. I have had to clarify the nade ruling MANY times in the past, even before I had admin. I've only included things that have been issues, or can be issues if you don't update based upon recent rulings. I CAN go full rules lawyer on you if you care to see it, but I have avoided it, and once again, as I assumed you meant, only brought up things that have been or are issues.

And on the Gloves, that's the item self producing, not a class.

[maynard]

I'm well aware you can nitpick/go full lawyer about shit that no one is having issues with and try and claim they are one. but once again, that's not what I'm looking for.

and yes, I know the nade rule kinda went it's own direction lol... not overly sure how exactly it came 2 be the way it is... prob from new admins enforcing shit that's not true as that's normally how things end up getting fucked... I will be making a thread eventually with a vote poll where you guys can decide how you want that rule 2 play out which would be

-change it back 2 the original way which is no special nades on the objective at all.
-keep the same as is now.

I have a feeling you guys will want it reverted back 2 the original but 2 be sure will let you guys do a vote.



throw all the suggestions at me you want, just make ones that are actual issues please, or gray area's that often come up and could use clarification. some of the things you said I fully agree on, and have already written down into my list for the changes... and some of the other things are like.... o_O?

the goal of the re-vamp of the rules is 2 prevent confusion and bickering regarding rules... mostly that seems 2 fall on summons, nades and wards. if there's other things, feel free 2 list them.

if it's not an issue coming up all the time, I'm not interested in it.... or at the very least coming up once in a while.

---------- Post added at 03:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:45 PM ----------

oh and

"Like I said, simply add the part about "by Eye Ra". People have claimed Pano is summoning because it takes them from where they are, and have warded sites/spawns because of it."

yes, now that I see what you are getting at, I agree on that. will further clarify that passive summons like rematch do not count for bypassing the no warding objectives rule... that you only can when a eye ra summons you.

[Steamer]

I will add a new rule stating that killing yourself via console is deemed an exploit of the server unless you're stuck in the map/glitched. granted if you find yourself in a glitch and are infused with the map and can't get out of it, a self slay in that situation would be acceptable as it would help not prolong the round.

No more void trolling... QQ

Least I can still jump off shit and in traps... Yay.

Cut camping is not allowed off rule 4, we all have enough mental power to KNOW when the objective is and won't be completed and place punishment there after. I personally don't see it as needed in part of the rules. Will cut the confusion from idiots, and still allow for objective completion rule to stay in it's current perspective, which is just fine.

Nade rule reverted.

[What]

5. Wards are not allowed to fully block an objective. Warding rooms that contain hostages is not allowed, however, if a shadow hunter is summoned to the objective, the shadow hunter does reserve the right to drop his wards. This rule applies too strider as well.


Typo: the "to" before strider has an extra o

[Erdenay]

Just to be clear... Hostie rescue zones CAN'T be warded by either side... Correct?

[maynard]

Just to be clear... Hostie rescue zones CAN'T be warded by either side... Correct?

wrong.

[brett friggin favre]

wrong.
so that's not considered part of the objective?

[maynard]

as long as there's another route it's fine....

look at office for example, the right side where the stairs come down into the rescue zone always ends up getting warded, it's never been an issue, nor is now.

these situations are often situational, and a CT wanting 2 drop a ward in his spawn is fine... there's a huge difference between doing that, and purposely blocking off both ends.

[brett friggin favre]

well my interpretation of what tom was talking about is whether or not wards can be placed directly inside the rescue zone. for example, on assault, can you place wards which touch the hostage rescue zone? keep in mind, there's only one zone there. i was under the impression that these zones were to be treated like bombsites, you can ward around them as long as there's a path and it's not touching the site itself.

[maynard]

wards shouldn't touch the bombsite ever.

the question what was asked of me was "can CT's ward there own spawn if there is a hostage zone close by it" my answer was yes, as each team reserves the right 2 ward there own spawn when needed 2 deal with mole's...

as I said, it's situational and really comes down 2 if the person was just using a ward in combat, or if they had the hostages and were dropping them at the start of the rescue zone so no one can follow.

from my understanding of the situation, there was no hostages involved in the scenario, it was simply a matter of "can a ward touch a rescue zone" and the answer 2 that would be yes, office being a prime example.

tiz just another gray area.

[Erdenay]

well my interpretation of what tom was talking about is whether or not wards can be placed directly inside the rescue zone. for example, on assault, can you place wards which touch the hostage rescue zone? keep in mind, there's only one zone there. i was under the impression that these zones were to be treated like bombsites, you can ward around them as long as there's a path and it's not touching the site itself.

Brett would be correct. That was my exact interpretation - and I've always seen it enforced like that.


wards shouldn't touch the bombsite ever.

the question what was asked of me was "can CT's ward there own spawn if there is a hostage zone close by it" my answer was yes, as each team reserves the right 2 ward there own spawn when needed 2 deal with mole's...

as I said, it's situational and really comes down 2 if the person was just using a ward in combat, or if they had the hostages and were dropping them at the start of the rescue zone so no one can follow.

from my understanding of the situation, there was no hostages involved in the scenario, it was simply a matter of "can a ward touch a rescue zone" and the answer 2 that would be yes, office being a prime example.

tiz just another gray area.

The CT ward was DIRECTLY in the hostage rescue zone, not close by... There were no hostages being rescued at that time, but it was definitely IN the area. So just to be clear on the exact rule:

You may ward the hostage zone as long as it does not DIRECTLY interfere with hostage rescue and leaves a path to somehow get there. Would that be correct?

[maynard]

You may ward the hostage zone as long as it does not DIRECTLY interfere with hostage rescue and leaves a path to somehow get there. Would that be correct?

yupyup.

cause if we changed it and the rule was "no warding hostage zones" that would make a even bigger mess of gray areas as it would conflit with other rules... like italy, you would not be able to ever ward your spawn, which we all know is an amazing deterrent against moles and forcing people off the race. pretty much would be the same for office... just makes things even more of a pain in the ass 2 properly regulate and keep on top of.

[CYBER]

yupyup.cause if we changed it and the rule was "no warding hostage zones" that would make a even bigger mess of gray areas as it would conflit with other rules... like italy, you would not be able to ever ward your spawn, which we all know is an amazing deterrent against moles and forcing people off the race. pretty much would be the same for office... just makes things even more of a pain in the ass 2 properly regulate and keep on top of.in office, there were times where i warded a corner of the left-side room, but hosties were still reachable around the ward from the right side in the same room. There was narrow path to them. Narrow, but damageless indeed. People bitched that 'its not allowed to ward hostie rooms at all!' ... Meanwhile any idiot could have simply walked around it (i checked myself... did i just set myself up for this joke??) and save the hosties... So which is yeay or nay? No wards at ALL in rooms containing hosties? Or ok as long as there's that fucking free path?

[maynard]

well they would be correct in that statement cause warding hostie rooms is not allowed... don't confuse this with hostage zones... they are obviously 2 diff things.

but it states right in the rules that your wards cant touch the room hostages are in.... that was added like 7 months ago or so cause people were getting 2 careless and often blocking the objective with wards and causing problems.

when there is a ban on warding something, it means your ward radius can't touch that specific room and or object at all.

[CYBER]

well they would be correct in that statement cause warding hostie rooms is not allowed... don't confuse this with hostage zones... they are obviously 2 diff things.but it states right in the rules that your wards cant touch the room hostages are in.... that was added like 7 months ago or so cause people were getting 2 careless and often blocking the objective with wards and causing problems.when there is a ban on warding something, it means your ward radius can't touch that specific room and or object at all.ahh.. Well i am careful with my wards. I guess i missed that rule update. Will carry on then.

[tj26]

WCS Rules


4. The objective must be respected and completed. camping is not allowed.





Had people question me on this today about camping hosties as a T and bomb sites as a CT, Common sense tells me that would be the objective, I'd hate to spell every situation out for people but if it would be possible to reword it a bit it would give me far less headaches

[Bane of Soldiers]

Had people question me on this today about camping hosties as a T and bomb sites as a CT, Common sense tells me that would be the objective, I'd hate to spell every situation out for people but if it would be possible to reword it a bit it would give me far less headaches

Wait, some people lack the common sense to understand that "no camping" is applied to the team that is inclined to do something, aka, their objective? And, essentially, people are complaining when the other team gives them a rough time about it, as they should? There are people actually like this on the server? o.O


Edit: Complaining as in complaining that it is/should be illegal, not general annoyance lol

[Obez]

WCS Rules

4. The objective must be respected and completed. camping is not allowed.


Could you clarify this stating that whoever must complete the objective is not allowed to camp?

Example: T's can't camp on Dust or CT's can't camp on Italy or Office

And yes, people complain that T's camp the hosties at Italy. Fucking idiotic lol.

Thanks!

[tj26]

Wait, some people lack the common sense to understand that "no camping" is applied to the team that is inclined to do something, aka, their objective? And, essentially, people are complaining when the other team gives them a rough time about it, as they should? There are people actually like this on the server? o.O


Edit: Complaining as in complaining that it is/should be illegal, not general annoyance lol

unfortunately bane this is the world we live in, people were complaining about camping objectives and i had other people complain that i kept camping in office a little while ago while on T. Apparently its a hard concept to understand

[brett friggin favre]

they can complain all they want. they are wrong.

[maynard]

few rule updates.



No fire-nade or poison-smoke nades are allowed on the objective at anytime.




Self slaying is not allowed on the server. It is only acceptable during a time in which a player may be glitched into the map or an object and is stuck and not able to get out of the situation.

[What]

Can self-slaying be allowed if two vagas have themselves stuck and they are the only ones remaining?

[maynard]

sure. if you're legitimately stuck/glitched and there is no way 2 get out of it, it's fine. That rule is more aimed at the people who abuse self slay so they can try and proc death abilities.

[CYBER]

Can self-slaying be allowed if two vagas have themselves stuck and they are the only ones remaining?
the way i used to enforce this was that if 2 vagas or raps were the last 2 players in the game, and got stuck with no chance of a teammate respawning, i'd usually let whoever did NOT complete his objectif to slay himself. I.e CT vaga kills self on cs_maps and T vaga kills self on de_ maps...

The reason is because : should we wait for the timer to finish, thats which team would have won. This way teams get justice when it comes to round wins and money earned.

But maymay? Question? Should the objectif-looser be FORCED to slay themselves in this case because it's delaying the round? Or just be a courtesy act?

[maynard]

well the odds of both being stuck at the same time and being the last 2 people are pretty rare... but in that event, you can keep handling it the way you have been.

personally, if I saw someone was stuck and couldn't get out, id just slay them, regardless of what team they are on or anything.

[CYBER]

well the odds of both being stuck at the same time and being the last 2 people are pretty rare... but in that event, you can keep handling it the way you have been.

personally, if I saw someone was stuck and couldn't get out, id just slay them, regardless of what team they are on or anything.
actually it happens quite often... and i give them the chance to kill themselves and be courteous about it . Otherwise, if there is still a lot of time on the timer, i usually slay the same guy who didnt complete the objective.


BTW, this is for Birdman and others who JUST asked me this:
If as a vaga, as long as there are enemies or teammates that are able to move and complete the objective, you CANNOT SLAY YOURSELF.
This applies to whether the enemies got u cornered as a vaga and are :
1- searching for u.
2- decided to keep u stuck and save hosties or blow up the bomb.

You CANNOT slay yourself because you are:
1- denying XP for the person who is gonna kill ur stuck-ass.
2- Enemies can chose to save the hosties or plant the bomb and get more cash from the win as opposed to fighting over who kills you.

So to summarize: STUCK = unable to move for the objective because you are stuck in a deadlock, which involves YOU, your environment, your allies AND the enemies, no matter how variables changed.
As long as you are inside the map, unglitched, and there is someone alive that is moving and that has the ability to TAKE YOU OUT, u cannot slay yourself.

After round is over, if u decided to slay urself to remove a kit from a vaga/rap/nebula i honestly couldnt give a damn.

i know maymay's gonna say smthn like " its obvious in the rules" ... but trust me man, i just had 3 ppl ask me about this same shit..

[ThA_DeAgLiZeR]

id appreciate it if all admins could review my post under the admin section regarding a new rule :\
thanks guys,
kenny aka deag

[Passarelli]

So on crackhouse, (and on other small maps where wards are very restricted) I have seen many an argument break out over hell hunters use of fire grenades. Smoke grenades are a large AOE and go through barriers and restrict primary walkways that would prevent the objective from being completed (stops Ts from running out of the house or CTs from coming in) so bitching about their use is understandable. But a good fire grenade right on the windows where Ts like to camp and shoot out of--as in the two windows that the hosties are in--should be ok as long as the walkways into and to the hosties are not blocked, correct? Everyone says that they count as wards, however this is not stated in the rules and I talked to Maynard and confirmed that fire nades ≠ wards. Thanks.

[SCRIBBLE]

however this is not stated in the rules and I talked to Maynard and confirmed that fire nades ≠ wards. Thanks.

You have your answer then, they can be used but they can not be placed anywhere that is on the objective. There must be a clear path to the objective so do not nade every route to the objective.

maynard's word is better than gold when it comes to wcs.

[Passarelli]

Truth, but I'd like it publicly posted by a senior admin though, so it can be straight from the horse's mouth and so I can just link to the post when people bitch. ^_^


EDIT: fixed my syntax

[What]

Just got to make sure your throwing those nades accurately, cause if you over throwing them and they land on an objective you got yourself a problem, especially if a bunch of idiots feel its reliable excuse that they weren't intending to do that.

[Nemesis]

Just got to make sure your throwing those nades accurately, cause if you over throwing them and they land on an objective you got yourself a problem, especially if a bunch of idiots feel its reliable excuse that they weren't intending to do that.

If it happens once by mistake there isn't a problem, it's when it starts to happen consistently there is an issue.

[CYBER]

last time i talked with maynard, he said that hell hunter grenades are not to TOUCH the objective whatsoever.
that means on crackhouse, u cannot through any kind of those grenades onto the hostage room bcos theyd block the path towards them and hurt the hosties.


That being said, he said it's perfectly fine to through one of those nades at the bottom floor of the house or above it or even inside, AS LONG AS THE RANGE DOESNT TOUCH THE HOSTIES RADIUS AT ALL.
AND u are not allowed to spam them. one is fine at a random legit spot not included in the scenario above, 2+ is pushing it.

Wards cannot be used whatsoever on the house, but thats how i've been told to handle these matters.

also, rules for CS_crackhouse apply exactly the same to DE_crackhouse. hosties or no hosties. same rules + u have the bombsites to worry about.

[Passarelli]

Next time I'm on and no one else is, I'll post a few screenshots as to what I'm talking about from inside and outside the house.

[maynard]

nades are allowed on the smaller maps provided they don't touch the objective... but it's up 2 the user 2 control and make sure they are properly placed, as it's quite easy 2 fuck up or make a mistake which would go against the rules.

[|2esolution]

Hey guys just had a quick question. I summoned someone on Dolls into a rat trap the other day and I really enjoyed it :P is that legal? Also this may have been addressed @ 1point but are hell hunter nades considered to be wards and not to be used in "rooms" containing hostages or on bomb objectives? In the case that they are "which I believe they are" are they also not to be used in the maps that wards are restricted like nipperhouse, crackhouse etc.... Also last one is are wards permitted in the house on crackhouse if it's de_crackhouse rather than cs?

[|2esolution]

Ok question was answered above didn't read it :P

[Trakil]

If say on Dust 2 there are folks using flash grenades to go on the roof and stand on a building where no one can see or shoot them but they can see where everyone is moving and times their attacks to move out and kill someone then move back into hiding. Is this a violation of Rule 3? I need clarification on this.
Thanks
Deathwish

[XX0wnsXY]

If say on Dust 2 there are folks using flash grenades to go on the roof and stand on a building where no one can see or shoot them but they can see where everyone is moving and times their attacks to move out and kill someone then move back into hiding. Is this a violation of Rule 3? I need clarification on this.
Thanks
Deathwish

They can only be in that spot while passing through. Otherwise, the player has to be visible and penetrable.

[What]

Are you sure he was completely unable to be seen or perhaps he was just not visible from certain angles.

[Passarelli]

I'm pretty sure he was unable to be seen from any angles. I wasn't specing the person doing it, but someone else was. He was camping a spot watching through the walls then popping up to shoot them when they ran out. I believe it was Tom (under the name abuse) who said it was legal, and was yelling at myself and Trakil when we were saying it wasn't. This was the 2nd time in two days admins have misinterpreted rule 3. Whee. <3 you guys anyways!

[Trakil]

He couldn't be seen from anywhere. its the roof area right above CT spawn and between the domes above site B. I was in spec looking at the angles. you can see down but no one else could see you

[Passarelli]

Any admins mind clarifying a rule for me? Someone today used the kill command at the end of the round so that they would not have a defuse kit as a vagalion. This is illegal if you read the rule, however, several people in game who are regulars said it was a perfectly legitimate thing to do. Just want to make sure I'm not wrong on this. Thanks!

[brett friggin favre]

Any admins mind clarifying a rule for me? Someone today used the kill command at the end of the round so that they would not have a defuse kit as a vagalion. This is illegal if you read the rule, however, several people in game who are regulars said it was a perfectly legitimate thing to do. Just want to make sure I'm not wrong on this. Thanks!

the fact that the kit doesn't become invisible is essentially a bug, so in killing yourself, you fix the bug. and if that's not a suitable enough answer, there's a tradeoff because you lose your items in the process.

[Chikun]

Any admins mind clarifying a rule for me? Someone today used the kill command at the end of the round so that they would not have a defuse kit as a vagalion. This is illegal if you read the rule, however, several people in game who are regulars said it was a perfectly legitimate thing to do. Just want to make sure I'm not wrong on this. Thanks!

That's the key phrase there. Not illegal in the slightest. It's only illegal to use the kill command to deny xp if someone is about to kill you.

[CYBER]

Any admins mind clarifying a rule for me? Someone today used the kill command at the end of the round so that they would not have a defuse kit as a vagalion. This is illegal if you read the rule, however, several people in game who are regulars said it was a perfectly legitimate thing to do. Just want to make sure I'm not wrong on this. Thanks!as long as they are doing it AT THE END of the round when no other enemy has a chance to kill them? Then it's fine. I do it all the time, but i never deny the enemy the chance to get xp but if no more enemies alive? Go for it. In fact, u lose all ur items in the process and any armor, not to mention that it DOES count towards ur killdeathratio (kdr) ... So there is a tradeoff and when there's a tradeoff, there is balance and fairness.

[coke_is_awesome]

Cool rules nice and short i think i like them.

[CYBER]

Cool rules nice and short i think i like them.didnt we perma ban this fuck? (Phiiiiiil!)? Or is it a bot?

[Wolfenstinger]

Whats the view on people that die at the start of the round and then rejoin and join the same team again to respawn?

I've seen it done multiple times lately. And it's been quite abusive + unsuccessful at times.

Ex: Player A dies to Player B at like 2:58. Player A leaves and rejoins. Joins same team. Player A is now alive (again) with $800 but he is then killed by Player B because Player A sucks.
Just a scenario - i've not seen it SUCCESSFUL but its just one of the few things I'd see. Can post a demo if needed as I have one available in a bit.

[acolyte_to_jippity]

Whats the view on people that die at the start of the round and then rejoin and join the same team again to respawn?

I've seen it done multiple times lately. And it's been quite abusive + unsuccessful at times.

Ex: Player A dies to Player B at like 2:58. Player A leaves and rejoins. Joins same team. Player A is now alive (again) with $800 but he is then killed by Player B because Player A sucks.
Just a scenario - i've not seen it SUCCESSFUL but its just one of the few things I'd see. Can post a demo if needed as I have one available in a bit.

rejoining to spawn back in is not, as far as i am aware, allowed.

[brett friggin favre]

rejoining to spawn back in is not, as far as i am aware, allowed.

This. It goes under exploitation.

[Chikun]

Whats the view on people that die at the start of the round and then rejoin and join the same team again to respawn?

I've seen it done multiple times lately. And it's been quite abusive + unsuccessful at times.

Ex: Player A dies to Player B at like 2:58. Player A leaves and rejoins. Joins same team. Player A is now alive (again) with $800 but he is then killed by Player B because Player A sucks.
Just a scenario - i've not seen it SUCCESSFUL but its just one of the few things I'd see. Can post a demo if needed as I have one available in a bit.

If it's a regular do tell.

[i2o4]

This. It goes under exploitation.

Oh, I never knew that. I'll admit I've done it. Won't anymore.

[DJ_MikeyRevile]

This. It goes under exploitation.

Then would this also apply to players who meta game with scrolls?
Respawning with a scroll after speccing the players who are still alive. Ex. A t dies early game, specs a few cts and sees that they are in T spawn. T then proceeds to scroll because T knows the exact location of all the enemies now.

[i2o4]

Then would this also apply to players who meta game with scrolls?
Respawning with a scroll after speccing the players who are still alive. Ex. A t dies early game, specs a few cts and sees that they are in T spawn. T then proceeds to scroll because T knows the exact location of all the enemies now.

Now, this I don't think I've ever done, but even if a T decided to scroll as shadow hunter and drop wards on a CT in T spawn after seeing him there from spec, I think it would be allowable. But then again, what do I know? I used to rejoin after dying early in my first round simply because I have a superstition against starting a map with a negative score, and I didn't think there was anything wrong with that either.

[maynard]

Then would this also apply to players who meta game with scrolls?
Respawning with a scroll after speccing the players who are still alive. Ex. A t dies early game, specs a few cts and sees that they are in T spawn. T then proceeds to scroll because T knows the exact location of all the enemies now.

pretty sure I already explained this 2 you, but no, that's not against any rule.

[brett friggin favre]

Scrolls cost a bunch and youre still respawning in your own spawn, so unless the enemies are there they could move before you get to them anyway. Also no matter what when you scroll, you know where enemies were when they killed you.

The scroll is an extra life combined with an expensive radar essentially.

[DJ_MikeyRevile]

i only bring it up again as there have been some changes made to the server that essentially allow a losing team, for ex. 15 - 0 to buy a scroll for virtually nothing 10 times in a round. Perhaps limiting the numbers of scrolls a player can purchase each round.

[maynard]

I prefer it this way... now the losing team can't QQ =)

[brett friggin favre]

I prefer it this way... now the losing team can't QQ =)

Unless it's cyber. As long as there's cyber, there will always be QQ

[i2o4]

i only bring it up again as there have been some changes made to the server that essentially allow a losing team, for ex. 15 - 0 to buy a scroll for virtually nothing 10 times in a round. Perhaps limiting the numbers of scrolls a player can purchase each round.

minor detail, but the losing team gets a maximum 75% shopmenu discount when down by 15 rounds, so $15k buys 8 scrolls at $1875 each. i think scrolls are fine as is, especially considering that by the time scrolls get that cheap, the map is usually almost over. and if they're scrolling without other items like laces against a dominating team, they're usually just an easy extra kill anyway.

regardless, it's almost inspirational when a losing team refuses to be defeated and repeatedly rallies back from the dead in the final rounds. even if they still don't manage to win a round, it can be a stirring sight.

[CYBER]

Then would this also apply to players who meta game with scrolls?Respawning with a scroll after speccing the players who are still alive. Ex. A t dies early game, specs a few cts and sees that they are in T spawn. T then proceeds to scroll because T knows the exact location of all the enemies now.SCROLLING or respawning after speccing enemies is perfectly fine and NOT exploit or ghosting. It's part of the allowed wcs mechanics, and if someone is in same spot after someone scrolls and hunts him, he deserves to die nway:p

---------- Post added at 07:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:04 PM ----------


minor detail, but the losing team gets a maximum 75% shopmenu discount when down by 15 rounds, so $15k buys 8 scrolls at $1875 each. i think scrolls are fine as is, especially considering that by the time scrolls get that cheap, the map is usually almost over. and if they're scrolling without other items like laces against a dominating team, they're usually just an easy extra kill anyway.regardless, it's almost inspirational when a losing team refuses to be defeated and repeatedly rallies back from the dead in the final rounds. even if they still don't manage to win a round, it can be a stirring sight.i agree. It gets a bit overwhelming sometimes, especially if the GOOD player joined the losing team to rack his kdr with these scrolls.... But it's fun to watch. And zero said he's implementing a fix that prevents players from exploiting the cheap items handicap by making the discount per loosing PLAYER, not team. So the stacking T that joins ct after 10 rounds for cheap items will not get a discount until HE has lost rounds WHILE on that losing team:)

---------- Post added at 07:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:08 PM ----------


Unless it's cyber. As long as there's cyber, there will always be QQhey fuck u! And fuck ur sig with wolf's quote!

[DJ_MikeyRevile]

SCROLLING or respawning after speccing enemies is perfectly fine and NOT exploit or ghosting. It's part of the allowed wcs mechanics, and if someone is in same spot after someone scrolls and hunts him, he deserves to die nway:p

---------- Post added at 07:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:04 PM ----------

i agree. It gets a bit overwhelming sometimes, especially if the GOOD player joined the losing team to rack his kdr with these scrolls.... But it's fun to watch. And zero said he's implementing a fix that prevents players from exploiting the cheap items handicap by making the discount per loosing PLAYER, not team. So the stacking T that joins ct after 10 rounds for cheap items will not get a discount until HE has lost rounds WHILE on that losing team:)

---------- Post added at 07:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:08 PM ----------

hey fuck u! And fuck ur sig with wolf's quote!

since your input is extremely late, id like you know that i already understand that ghosting in such a way is tolerable in the WCS server.

[CYBER]

since your input is extremely late, id like you know that i already understand that ghosting in such a way is tolerable in the WCS server.not even 1 day late:( i posted this as soon as i woke up:(

[jwtemp]

unless it's cyber. As long as there's wcs, there will always be qq

ftfy.