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View Full Version : Paradox? What do?



JollyBloo
01-01-2012, 10:23 AM
So i've noticed recently on a couple maps (zm_euronews for example) That there is a slight paradox in the zm rules. We cannot cade ALL entrances to a crouch spot but say there is two entrances then you can cade one. Now there is also the rule about no glitching doors etc. But can you glitch the door if there is another entrance? Apparently so (Though most said it was a gray area.)

Now here's where i'm lost. Now you have a small room with a door and a crouch entrance, Both can be caded and practically impossible to break, but is it legal? They cade the crouch spot in knowing there is a 2nd entrance but the 2nd entrance is glitched (The door). I personally think that these kinds of cades should be illegal, that any cade that glitches a door shouldn't be allowed even if there are other entrances :\

Meltdown
01-01-2012, 11:48 AM
I do say all spots that are impossible to get trough are illegal. And the second thing is I'm also against cading in crouch area's which makes it too easy for humans to defend.

acolyte_to_jippity
01-01-2012, 11:55 AM
I do say all spots that are impossible to get trough are illegal. And the second thing is I'm also against cading in crouch area's which makes it too easy for humans to defend.

well, if you cade one entrance of a crouch area, that takes away the number of people you can have in there. if there are two entrances, and you cade one, then you can only have 2 people in it at once. it's 2/opening, remember?

and, in answer to your question, no. if you glitch a door, then that is not considered an entrance. it is considered either a glitched door, or nothing. therefore, cading the crouch entrance would be cading the only entrance to a crouch spot. (crouch spot does not mean that you must be crouched while inside. it also applies to places one can ONLY get to by crouching (see red room on highschool; the only entrance requires you to crouch, so the entire area is referred to as a crouch spot)

there are some exceptions to the 2/entrance rule (off top of my head the vents in labor gigantic and the stage in highschool) but in general you should follow the 2/entrance rule

Meltdown
01-01-2012, 12:29 PM
well, if you cade one entrance of a crouch area, that takes away the number of people you can have in there. if there are two entrances, and you cade one, then you can only have 2 people in it at once. it's 2/opening, remember?

and, in answer to your question, no. if you glitch a door, then that is not considered an entrance. it is considered either a glitched door, or nothing. therefore, cading the crouch entrance would be cading the only entrance to a crouch spot. (crouch spot does not mean that you must be crouched while inside. it also applies to places one can ONLY get to by crouching (see red room on highschool; the only entrance requires you to crouch, so the entire area is referred to as a crouch spot)

there are some exceptions to the 2/entrance rule (off top of my head the vents in labor gigantic and the stage in highschool) but in general you should follow the 2/entrance rule

I just love it to see some more teamwork thus making things harder force people to think abit more. On the other hand it is probably never going to happen with the many randoms on the server who just ruin everything anyway (:

Andrew_Pavlik
01-01-2012, 12:35 PM
So i've noticed recently on a couple maps (zm_euronews for example) That there is a slight paradox in the zm rules. We cannot cade ALL entrances to a crouch spot but say there is two entrances then you can cade one. Now there is also the rule about no glitching doors etc. But can you glitch the door if there is another entrance? Apparently so (Though most said it was a gray area.)

Now here's where i'm lost. Now you have a small room with a door and a crouch entrance, Both can be caded and practically impossible to break, but is it legal? They cade the crouch spot in knowing there is a 2nd entrance but the 2nd entrance is glitched (The door). I personally think that these kinds of cades should be illegal, that any cade that glitches a door shouldn't be allowed even if there are other entrances :\

I know on euro news behind the wall with the glass room people always put the vending in front of the crouch spot and you can't open the door from the outside so I've always made people uncade it, but obviously I haven't been on the ZM servers in months so.... but to answer your question, yes it is illegal.

Rosie
01-01-2012, 03:10 PM
At one point there was a thread on this topic but I do not feel like looking it up. I assume you are talking about the small building with the hidden entrance in the lower right hand corner (facing it). If they glitch the door open and cade the entrance than it is legal. If it is closed it is up in the air. If there is a way to open the door from the outside such that it opens out then it would be legal. Understand just because you can not open it, does not mean that someone can't. I hate the spot, but I do not believe it is illegal. It is borderline, but not quite.


I found the old thread.

http://www.ibisgaming.com/forums/showthread.php/6860-zm_euronews-cading-spot.-Blocking-door-from-opening.

JollyBloo
01-01-2012, 03:21 PM
I'm still getting two answers :< One side (Aco) Is saying as soon as you glitch that door so that when you try opening it it just shuts again its not longer considered an entrance or its just a glitched door which is against the rules. However if its not considered an entrance then all that is left is the crouch spot in which would be caded which is also illegal. So therefore the spot IS illegal? If the door WAS HAPPENED to be glitched OPEN then yeah I see no problem with the spot, but if its glitched closed and the crouch spot is caded also I feel it would be against the rules/illegal?

Rosie
01-01-2012, 03:31 PM
I base my answer off of Anex's answer. If clan says it is good, then its good. Unless Zero says no.

Bane of Soldiers
01-01-2012, 04:20 PM
Jollyboo is referring to the women's bathroom on euronews, not that glassy room.

The women's door hinges only swing inward from what I've seen. Here are some screenies from inside and outside:

4730
4731
4732
4733

JollyBloo
01-01-2012, 05:07 PM
I actually meant both since both can be door glitched D: From what i've seen the past few times we've been there :<

Bane of Soldiers
01-01-2012, 05:17 PM
The spot's annoying and all, but I would also agree with aNex's decision (not like it matters since he's clan). Both doors, to the women's and the glassy room's, don't glitch to the point that they won't open. They open partially, and may push the props around and create enough space to jump through. Instances when door glitching was ruled are when a human spams their "use" key to the point the door won't even open or a prop serves for the same purpose. I think the difference is whether the door opens at all

Rosie
01-02-2012, 10:04 AM
As far as the bathroom goes it can easily be broken. You just have to know how to open the door. I will not tell you because that is wher I cade on that map. Never with the door closed though. How can you even kill anyone.

JollyBloo
01-02-2012, 12:19 PM
As far as the bathroom goes it can easily be broken. You just have to know how to open the door. I will not tell you because that is wher I cade on that map. Never with the door closed though. How can you even kill anyone.

Last guy I saw in there he didn't, he kept the door blocked with a vending machine so everytime you opened it it shut right away, and he kept one in the vent as well. All he did was shoot the vending machines to fix them time to time, :|

acolyte_to_jippity
01-02-2012, 12:21 PM
in a case like that, where it's physically impossible to open the door (and it cannot ever swing outward) it is 100% illiegal i believe

Sinsanity
01-05-2012, 12:27 PM
I've seen Rezel ban people for jamming that door. So I would say yea that's an illegal maneuver. Plus o could e sworn I read it somewhere in the rules forbidding jamming doors to the point that you cannot enter them, and this spot is one of them.

anex
01-05-2012, 05:04 PM
Glitching is defined as when the function of that prop, door in this case, ceases to work. As in, the door won't function regardless if any props are behind it or not. Putting a soda machine behind a door does not equal "glitching". I'll update that in the rules so we can be clear on that and have no made up definitions.

If it was inadvertantly glitched, then it would act as a wall and thus blocking the crouched enterance would make the spot illegal.

Does this door not open outward? Can you glitch through props on this map?

Ugh, looking at those screenshots made me we want to play. Damn it.

Steamer
01-05-2012, 05:26 PM
They swing out with the right trickery.

anex
01-05-2012, 05:37 PM
Thats what I thought. So people complaining because they don't know how to open a door the opposite way?

Steamer
01-05-2012, 05:42 PM
Pretty much. Rules are clear. Not hard to understand. Admins misinterpret them to their own liking.

JollyBloo
01-06-2012, 01:44 AM
I had no idea you could open a door the opposite way (Towards yourself), being as i've just gotten back into zm recently :P As for glitching through objects i've not seen it done with this type of cade though i've seen it happen with cades that use like crates or sofas. I have yet to see someone actually open that door the opposite way but i'd definately take both your words on it since you've been playing longer then me.

So that being, it's not considered glitched as long as the door still opens somewhat. Thanks :P