Mutnaggewinu, 2/7/12, ~11am ET, STEAM_0:1:8615467

[brett friggin favre]

Name in Game: Mutnaggewinu
Steam-ID: STEAM_0:1:8615467
Where: Gungame
Link to any previous bans: http://www.ibisgaming.com/sourcebans/index.php?p=banlist&searchText=+STEAM_0%3A1%3A8615467&Submit=
Reason to perma ban: walls

i know mut's been discussed, banned for hacking once, and unbanned. i haven't seen anything out of the ordinary until today. maybe i'm just in a pissy mood cuz my class got cancelled and i didnt get an email about it, but watch the demo. watch his para round, ticks 23k, 31k, 38k, and the 2 rounds after tick 38k.

mut, if it's my tired eyes deceiving me, i'm sorry. nothing personal brah. at least i'm not an admin banning you first, then posting this. it's mostly for a second/third/fourth opinion on what i'm seeing.

edit: forgot to make poll voting public and can't find a way to change that. hmm...oops.

[Rosie]

His para round looks real suspicious. Why you would run to their spawn and then jump over a box and shoot the guy at your spawn when all you have been doing is staring at a box is beyond me.

[Steamer]

Para round looks like he is toggling walls.
38000 is one massive trace.
The rest are meh and can be related to sound and radar, even if it does look like he is tracing paths....

Si.

[CYBER]

FUCK mutt...
seriously? you're a good guy and all, im honestly gonna miss playing with ya to be honest... Can't say i didnt spend many hours of many nights watching demos of you playing in slow -mo and wireframe because of how sketchy you were... but regardless... ur hacking, faggotty ass shall be missed... i mean, you're a good player without the walls i assume... why go there in the first place? ... May I say kudos on being the best wallhacker i've ever seen and gone "unnoticed".

Brett, :tips_hat: for your amazing work, even as a non admin, i really respect and admire your dedication for the community.
But i also want to point out that: in the end, shady did warn us all that he walled, and although he couldnt get enough proof to back the claim, i'd like to give him credit for sticking to his opinion regardless of what others said. same goes for owns.

watching the demo as we speak... genuinely upset lol...
please mutt:

4919 of ibis ...

[Steamer]

Shady made aware for all to watch the guy. Good work there also. :wtg:

[brett friggin favre]

Brett, :tips_hat: for your amazing work, even as a non admin, i really respect and admire your dedication for the community.
But i also want to point out that: in the end, shady did warn us all that he walled, and although he couldnt get enough proof to back the claim, i'd like to give him credit for sticking to his opinion regardless of what others said. same goes for owns.


thanks cyber, i do what i do :P i just like calling bullshit and being right about it XD

and now i can take pride in knowing that there were a few times where i beat him and he could've been hacking during those times, which also feels nice.

and yes, thanks to shady as well

[SHADY V1RU5]

:wtg: :lmao: :assault: :reddot: o and mutt :plzdie: i told u someone would get hard evidence and i called that shit from day one when u were playin nice to know that i can still pwn a faggoty hacker :stupid:

thank god!!! fml lol ok now remove his stats and shit lol he dont deserve a fuckin lick of mentioning since u got caught being cocky >.<

Shady V1RU5 approves this message ...... +1 guys

[Kryp]

Fuck Mut the fuckin homo

[Jackie Marlow]

I really liked the guy. This is so fucking disappointing. I'm honestly kind of bummed.

[CYBER]

I really liked the guy. This is so fucking disappointing. I'm honestly kind of bummed.Trust me, i feel the same...But sometimes we have to abide by our rules, beliefs and duties...He'll be missed on the server, he fucked himself over by hacking... It's his loss the most considering he just lost all his friends in ibis....

[Jackie Marlow]

Trust me, i feel the same...But sometimes we have to abide by our rules, beliefs and duties...He'll be missed on the server, he fucked himself over by hacking... It's his loss the most considering he just lost all his friends in ibis....
Oh yeah, I agree. I'm disappointed in his actions - not the result.

And whoever said it is totally right - he's really a good player, anyway. It's a huge prick move to hack when you already have more skill than most.

[Mut]

Hey guys... I don't cheat and never will. Shady has had it in for me since day one... I'm gonna post an unban and see how it goes from there. Cyber, Jackie, guys I don't cheat and never will. I've been playing a real long time since 1.0... I'm not the best and with all the loss & choke I've been having I try to play earlier in the morning cause it's less laggy for me and when I shoot my bullets actually hit the target. I have never been disrespectful to anyone of u guys, even after you guys speak so harshly of me, I expect it from Shady but he just needs to grow up and stop thinking he's the best. You found nothing guys, I am gonna look at the demo but despite those "claims" of me walling or what have you I do not hack, i have never cheated and I never will. I know my truths... Think of if this way, I don't drink, I don't do drugs, I don't smoke and I don't even swear minus ass or dumbass and I have repeated B*tches name on a few occasions. lol Why would I cheat, I have too much respect for myself as a person and as a dad to ever cheat in a silly game like this, one I do enjoy playing. :D I personally believe that this is some sort of witch hunt, more so from a few others but esp shady... But I will speak my peace and whatever the decision that is made I will respect but I will leave knowing I have not once cheated and for others to accuse me becuase they look at a demo that looks suspicious without no proof says more about them than it does me. Welalin Aqq nemutlasn' nitap'k! ( Thanks and see you around my friends.)

[brett friggin favre]

Hey guys... I don't cheat and never will. Shady has had it in for me since day one... I'm gonna post an unban and see how it goes from there. Cyber, Jackie, guys I don't cheat and never will. I've been playing a real long time since 1.0... I'm not the best and with all the loss & choke I've been having I try to play earlier in the morning cause it's less laggy for me and when I shoot my bullets actually hit the target. I have never been disrespectful to anyone of u guys, even after you guys speak so harshly of me, I expect it from Shady but he just needs to grow up and stop thinking he's the best. You found nothing guys, I am gonna look at the demo but despite those "claims" of me walling or what have you I do not hack, i have never cheated and I never will. I know my truths... Think of if this way, I don't drink, I don't do drugs, I don't smoke and I don't even swear minus ass or dumbass and I have repeated B*tches name on a few occasions. lol Why would I cheat, I have too much respect for myself as a person and as a dad to ever cheat in a silly game like this, one I do enjoy playing. :D I personally believe that this is some sort of witch hunt, more so from a few others but esp shady... But I will speak my peace and whatever the decision that is made I will respect but I will leave knowing I have not once cheated and for others to accuse me becuase they look at a demo that looks suspicious without no proof says more about them than it does me. Welalin Aqq nemutlasn' nitap'k! ( Thanks and see you around my friends.)

i've been around for quite some time too. cs 1.4 or 1.3..one of those two i think, idk it was before famas and galil. anyways, i've never considered you to be a hacker until i saw a few things this morning that just made me go hmmmmm. i looked at the demo and there's just some stuff i can't explain with sound, radar, or anything else. and not in a bill o'reilly way. in the first round, i have no idea what made you want to run to t spawn, sit in a corner, look at a box, and then just all of a sudden just jump up and shoot someone. that's where your experience argument goes against you...experiences people don't sit in corners looking at boxes. there were also walltraces and times where you'd shoot a glance over at the wall of the tower in the center. just the wall. not where you'd be able to shoot someone, just the wall. and it seemed more times than not that there was someone in there that your crosshairs just happened to go on or very near. some of what you do makes no sense whatsoever, especially for an experienced player, but you're too good to be a noob and doing things like...again...sitting in corners and staring at boxes.

[Mut]

I've made and seen some crazy shots, if you've been playing as long as I have man you've seen just about everything. I haven't viewed the demo as of yet but I will soon enough and then I will respond accordingly. But if you go through the games that 'ive played, I have shot ppl through walls, I've shot pp with head shots, I've wounded some ppl in the hopes I would do damage or think that someone might be there and once in a while when i'm really lucky I'll hit someone or kill them. That's CSS! I'm def not a new player but I will never play down or less to make ppl happy. I play how i feel it's that simple. I will not kiss anyone's ass to keep me on this server, my actions and my attitude thus far has been, I believe, respectful and full of joking/teasing. There are more than enough servers to play on and I believe there are more ppl here who think I don't cheat than think that i do. Irregardless of what some ppl think I will maintain what I've been saying and will keep on saying, "I DO NOT CHEAT IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM!"

[brett friggin favre]

I've made and seen some crazy shots, if you've been playing as long as I have man you've seen just about everything. I haven't viewed the demo as of yet but I will soon enough and then I will respond accordingly. But if you go through the games that 'ive played, I have shot ppl through walls, I've shot pp with head shots, I've wounded some ppl in the hopes I would do damage or think that someone might be there and once in a while when i'm really lucky I'll hit someone or kill them. That's CSS! I'm def not a new player but I will never play down or less to make ppl happy. I play how i feel it's that simple. I will not kiss anyone's ass to keep me on this server, my actions and my attitude thus far has been, I believe, respectful and full of joking/teasing. There are more than enough servers to play on and I believe there are more ppl here who think I don't cheat than think that i do. Irregardless of what some ppl think I will maintain what I've been saying and will keep on saying, "I DO NOT CHEAT IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM!"

i wasn't making any attack on your character, i wasn't asking you to play down or kiss ass, all i'm saying is that what i see in the demos does not make sense. you're right, i have seen a lot in my time playing cs. therefore my bs detector is pretty sharp. there's a process i go through:

1. that's bs.
2. spec
3a. did i see more bs? --> pull demo, proceed to 4
3b. no more bs? it was probably nothing. do not proceed to 4.
4. watch full demo of map for bs.
5a. did i see the bs i suspected? proceed to 6
5b. bs explained by radar/sound? do not proceed.
6. watch demo again, now with r_drawothermodels 2 on.
7a. did this explain the bs? if yes, hacks likely. more instances of speccing wallhacks explaining bs = more likely hacks
7b. still unexplained? keep an eye on him, but nothing conclusive.

your demo ended up in 7a, therefore i made this post.

[wack0]

doesn't hack, you bros dumb and mad. demo sucks.

[Mut]

Brett you can go through whatever process you need to still doesn't make it right or prove anything... u wrote initially: i know mut's been discussed, banned for hacking once, and unbanned. i haven't seen anything out of the ordinary until today. maybe i'm just in a pissy mood cuz my class got cancelled and i didnt get an email about it, but watch the demo. watch his para round, ticks 23k, 31k, 38k, and the 2 rounds after tick 38k.

mut, if it's my tired eyes deceiving me, i'm sorry. nothing personal brah. at least i'm not an admin banning you first, then posting this. it's mostly for a second/third/fourth opinion on what i'm seeing.

I'm not offended in the least Brett and I'm not taking it personally, not really... Just do what you think is right and how ever it goes one things i've been consistent on is no matter what you or anyone else believes I do not cheat, not now or ever. What I'm really upset with is that the travel agency for eductional tours royally messed up my trip to europe next month. My son is going with his class and I was an extra chaperone... Now that's something to be upset about! If not I'll just go put 5k$ down on a new truck! Have a great night all! :)

[carbon]

simply put, i don't think this is solid proof of wallhacking and i don't think mut is a hacker.

[Rosie]

Mutt I have nothing against you, and the few times we played together was fun. The trouble lies in the demo provided. As Brett said, you are staring at a box, and jump up and shoot a guy 3/4 across the map like he shot off a flare. When we see these demos all we can do is judge what is presented. Watch your own demo and tell us what you would think if it was someone other than you. If you watch the demo and think wow that looks like hacks, then you will understand our point. You could provide 100 demos of you not hacking, and if we see 5 seconds that looks too good to be true, then we have to judge that 5 seconds.

[roshill]

This is shocking and in a way hard to read. I have know you guys for a few months now. I have played in competitive games and what not since 1.6 and I have big check that went out to my clan to prove it. I can say this by experience that people who strive to achieve the best are ones who face the most trouble from any form or kind. This just might be one of them. I have not known Mut as you guys know him but from what I know he seems to be a Genuine guy. And based on his experience a score of 963 is not easy to come by. You really have to be at the top of your game to actually achieve or have alot of time on your hands.

Now after watching that demo I did see allot of different strategies Mut was using. And quite honestly they were really obvious and predictable on the part of the player that were playing against us. If you had been playing this long in all seriousness you would be using doing same things in a competitive match. The first move where he goes and sits behind the box was unpredictable and did bring him a few kills. Second time he went to the same spot to try that manoeuvre again he got shot and killed he change up his game he used that unsuspecting knife strategy where he sits down near the tower and waits for most of them to go in and jumps out and knife's them in the back. But remember he is still taking a risk still there a T could have popped up and caught him with cover behind those boxes.

I have no idea how many times he must have played that map in the past to have perfected on it but it seems like a strategy I can try some day. And I will for sure.

The other questionable kill was that HS that he got on RON Paul before the end of the game. And I can say that was judgement kill Ron had no other way that was as covered as that side track near the way leading towards the stair case and luckily his hunch was right and boom.

I know I don't have much of a say in this matter. I am a new admin I can just try to convey a message whereas upper admins have to decide on the matter. My recommendation to you is pull out as many games as you can and see as and find the games that can make or break this case. He deserves that guys he has worked really hard for this.

Coming to the point. Yes I have been off CSS for a really long time like 2 years while I was trying out other shooter games etc. What made me come back was the whole environment of this server or this game would have been rotting away like most others on my steam list. And yes off course score whoring. Now someday if I even come close to his gaming style and get a ban I know what he's going through. I have had huge disappointments in my time online too through other issues but long story short. Everyone deserves a second chance. And if you do find atleast 3 or 4 that actually look good at random ofcourse you can decide then.

Now I don't know what rates ticks etc etc stand for so. Guys don't start judging me over this you know what's right and what's wrong and I am not judging anyone here. Cause I love this server and everyone in it and I hope you take my suggestion openly.


Thanks,
IBIS Admin - Asim K.

[brett friggin favre]

let me say this. i know what it's like to be accused of hacking when i'm not ( http://www.ibisgaming.com/forums/showthread.php/4811-Check-this ). and if mut isn't hacking here, then i'll be the first to apologize for any inconvenience. i have no intention of stat whoring, getting rid of competition or anything like that. i brought up the demo because i saw something questionable in mut's play. i followed that formula i posted and it allows me, to the best of my ability, determine if someone is hacking or not. keywords. to the best of my ability. i posted here for second and third opinions, not for a personal vendetta with mut, not with any intentions except for keeping the servers as clean as possible. so far, those whose opinions i respect the most (outside mut, obviously i can't take your word for anything right now, all i can do is go off the evidence. again, nothing personal, but what i see is better evidence than what i hear) have agreed with my assessment of what i saw. i do hope the truth comes out, whatever it is. and if it turns out that mut is innocent, i'll look forward to playing with him more and kicking his ass more :smirk: . but again, all i can do is go off what i see, and what i see is, in my opinion, not the actions of a legit player.

also, i don't think i'm out of line in saying to shady that you shouldn't have banned him yet. this is the thread to request his ban, and it has not been determined yet whether or not he is hacking, no matter how the evidence may seem. i'm not positive on the protocol of this, but if it's a user ban request i believe no admin (with the exception of upper or clan) should have the authority to ban before a final judgement is made. i know you're eager to get rid of him, but if you weren't in the server at the time and a decision hasn't been made, i think that decision should be left to uppers.

[Dead]

Oh man. The demo will never satisfy anyone, it may show some bs but it is the same bs everyone pulls once in a while.

Lets take everything in cosideration.

1- The dude lives freaking far away from the server (nova scotia, his location, while the server seems to be located in Texas for some reason - I thought it was in VA). One thing I never understood is why would anyone play in a server with high latency, he gets 50-100 ping "randomly". He has been playing for a while so I think he should know by now that it isn't a good idead to play with such a high ping (I would never play in a server with a ping higher than 50), but then again, why leave if his registry is so freaking good in the server, he gets EVERYTHING. It is crazy.

2- From the screenshots I have seen he got in his steam account it seems he plays at a low resolution and with no custom configs, not even "net_graphic". Again, for someone who has been playing the game for so long (2005 from his steam page) it is kinda crazy that he would not try to get as much performance from the game and/or his computer as he can unless he was a casual player, but he is not since he plays 40 hours a week - that's not casual player time. So wtf.

3- He says that he got a daughter, but have you ever seen this daughter of his? I haven't... And I would never have a daughter, I would have a son, cause sons are better, they dont get pregnant and stuff.

So what I'm getting from all of this is that I suck at being a detective and I should stick to Web Dev and IT... And that I hate people with high pings.

But seriously, I think he is annoying and I mute him (and a few more of you) as soon as I hear his voice, but I don't think he hax.

[Rosie]

Shady's ban was at the request of a ULA.

[XX0wnsXY]

I don't know. This demo doesn't look all that fishy to me. I watched the tick marks you provided, and then some..but all in all, I just see some use of sounds, baiting, and when he shoots the guy behind the box, you can see the flare of his gun, so I think that's why he begins shooting at him. I don't think it's conclusive enough to ban him. My thinking is, if after all of this, he is hacking...then he will get caught. I just don't like the idea of banning someone on this type of evidence, whether the person is suspected 10 times, or once.

[Xerenix]

Never seriously thought you hacked Mut until i saw this demo. Numerous times you aimed right at a enemy through the boxes/walls.

Ban upgraded to perma.

Closing