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Thread: WCS rules questions

  1. Default WCS rules questions

    Since rules questions come up a lot in the server, as there is no hard and fast set that I can find, I was wondering what the official stance is on the following list:

    Eye Ra: Where can they not summon people? Over the edge in port where they are alive, but can't get to the objective. In crawlspaces where when you spawn, you are stuck. Are these valid examples? Are there more? (Also a possible glitch, it's ultimate is not blocked by any ultimate blockers)

    Skywalking: What is considered skywalking? For the races that can get outside the map boundaries, via high speed or teleporting. Getting to places you can't jump to with normal highjump, such as undead or flame pred. Getting to places you can't access with walkspeed flying(Archmage). Which of these is skywalking, or is there some other definition?

    Wards: For strider and Shadow Hunter, what is illegal placement? Spawns in the first X seconds. Next to objectives so the site is hit. Making the site inaccessible. What about after the hosties have moved, what's the ruling then? How about if it's reaction, such as eye ra summoning you, or being prog knifed somewhere, and laying it as you land due to gunfire?

    And my favourite, do the objective: What is "doing the objective"? How long do you have to do the objective? Am I truly forced to run in guns blazing towards the enemy who have the only objective totally surrounded or sniped? If I am picking them off one by one, such as with eye ra's or crypt lord's ultimate and will have them all killed by the end of the round, do I have to get myself killed? Am I not allowed to use the time given to me to do my objective, which, may I add, is ALSO kill all the enemies.

    If the objective is undoable, what has to be done? This comes up when the bomb is inaccessible or hosties are dead. Evas and crows on bomb maps or stuck in a wall.

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    Eye Ra: Can summon anywhere provided mission can still be accomplished. That dock spot shouldn't be allowed unless the Player can get back out to disarm bomb, etc. As far as I know glitch summoning is against the rules. And you'd have to ask Zero about the immunity thing.

    Skywalking: Very simple. As long as you can hit them, its legal. If they can't be shot but can hit you it illegal.

    Wards: The no wards in first few seconds relates to moling and dropping wards to kill off the entire opposing team in seconds. No Blocking of objectives. If Eye Ra summons you, you can drop ward regardless of where they summon you, as it is reflexive, and if they summon in the objective that was their risk to take. (Note: Everyone accidently drops one on objectives from time to time because of reflex, as long as you don't do it over and over.)

    Doing the objective: No long term camping(IE: Don't wait the entire round out, make SOME progress). As admin, I usually won't say anything unless the round time left is under 1 minute and people aren't heading in the direction of the objective.If the bomb or objective becomes unobtainable, essentially becomes deathmatch rules, end it as quick as possible.

    This is what I believe are the general rules for your question.
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    Thanks, that's basically what I thought, though many admins feel a lot differently with the camping rules.

    But you really didn't help with the skywalking one. Hit them with what? A glock? An AWP? A Knife? Weapons have different levels of piercing, so how many levels are acceptable?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    Since rules questions come up a lot in the server, as there is no hard and fast set that I can find, I was wondering what the official stance is on the following list:

    Eye Ra: Where can they not summon people? Over the edge in port where they are alive, but can't get to the objective. In crawlspaces where when you spawn, you are stuck. Are these valid examples? Are there more? (Also a possible glitch, it's ultimate is not blocked by any ultimate blockers)

    Skywalking: What is considered skywalking? For the races that can get outside the map boundaries, via high speed or teleporting. Getting to places you can't jump to with normal highjump, such as undead or flame pred. Getting to places you can't access with walkspeed flying(Archmage). Which of these is skywalking, or is there some other definition?

    Wards: For strider and Shadow Hunter, what is illegal placement? Spawns in the first X seconds. Next to objectives so the site is hit. Making the site inaccessible. What about after the hosties have moved, what's the ruling then? How about if it's reaction, such as eye ra summoning you, or being prog knifed somewhere, and laying it as you land due to gunfire?

    And my favourite, do the objective: What is "doing the objective"? How long do you have to do the objective? Am I truly forced to run in guns blazing towards the enemy who have the only objective totally surrounded or sniped? If I am picking them off one by one, such as with eye ra's or crypt lord's ultimate and will have them all killed by the end of the round, do I have to get myself killed? Am I not allowed to use the time given to me to do my objective, which, may I add, is ALSO kill all the enemies.

    If the objective is undoable, what has to be done? This comes up when the bomb is inaccessible or hosties are dead. Evas and crows on bomb maps or stuck in a wall.
    eye ra = no summoning in vents, people get stuck half the time cause they're not aware there being summond 2 a space you have 2 be ducking 2 fit into, this in turn glitches quite often and makes the person whose summond upper body glitch off the map. no summing people 2 fall 2 there death, or places where they would be stuck or unable 2 get out of. they obviously deserve a fighting chance. if you summon someone 2 the hosties and they drops wards as a result, it's legal. the warder obviously doesn't know where they are.

    skywalking is allowed aslong as you're in a spot that people can return fire 2. some places like under the map where you can shoot at people but they can't see you are not allowed.

    wards are allowed any where as long as they're not blocking objective, there has 2 be another route you can take 2 get 2 objective. strider is NOT allowed 2 drop teleport in the enemy spawn and then use it and ward at beginning of round. there's no warding enemy spawn at beginning of round period.

    as for the objective, you do the objective. if the objective is 2 get hosties and your CT, then you do it. CSS is a team based game, and there's no I in team. if all your teamates die, then you should be making your way 2 the objective. you don't have 2 go in guns blazing, but if you're last person or you see there's a minute or less left then you better get moving, cause not doing the objective is not allowed. if we didn't have this rule, every 1 would just camp everywhere and damn near every round would be a 3 minute round.
    Last edited by maynard; 11-01-2009 at 10:59 PM.

    Maynard - The WCS Guy

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    "no summing people 2 fall 2 there death. they obviously deserve a fighting chance." I've never heard this, in fact, I've only heard the exact opposite thing (see: the trolley on deathcookin)

    For skywalking: again, return fire with WHAT?

    What's the beginning of a round? 5 seconds? 10 seconds? 3 minutes? I won't do it(again) but still, open ended answers are useless.

    The objective is to rescue hosties/plant/defuse the bomb OR kill all the enemies. It is a team based game, and if you stop the enemy team, you win just as well as if you plant the bomb. This is a just as important goal, since at least as many rounds end due to TPK.

    But, making my way to the objective, just because I'm not running in like rambo when I've just been fighting people who I didn't kill, doesn't mean I'm not going to do it. It just means I'm not an idiot. (this comment is for slayings that have happened)

    We do (sort of) have this unwritten rule, and still, people on both sides camp, even with them being the last ones, and we almost never have 3 minute rounds, and when we do, it's usually down to the wire. Please don't tell me what I or anyone else would do, since you can only tell me what YOU would do.

    Also, why 1 minute? Why this arbitrary amount of time? I can plant the bomb in what, 3 seconds? Most maps you can get from one end of the map to the other in about 20 seconds, and with WCS, often less. Why do you force us to rush when we have plenty of time?

    Oh, and there is also no you(u) in team, but I can find a me On a related note, people who think kdr is the most important factor in determining who is a good player don't understand that this IS a team game, not a solo game.

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    fine ill be even more specific. look at what your objective is, how many people you have 2 go against and make sure you have enough time 2 do it. and I told you a while back when zero was in the game on Vegas that summoning people in the vents is NOT allowed because what I said happens did, my upper body was glitched off the map, and only me legs were in the game. I don't know what you're talking about in regards 2 summoning people to there death, but no, that's not allowed, and ive only seen a couple people do it in my daily playing there. and as for both sides camping.. well yeah... 1 side will always have that advantage. that's why we play diff maps, 2 switch it up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post

    Oh, and there is also no you(u) in team, but I can find a me .
    Don't make me stab you
    Last edited by maynard; 11-01-2009 at 11:34 PM.

    Maynard - The WCS Guy

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    I'm asking it so I can get the official word on things since there are MANY variations on peoples rulings.

    Most of them I know (such as vent summoning) but others don't. If there is some form of official word, and not just word of mouth, to show people, it makes life easier and ends up with less conflicting reports (see port and compound boundaries questions)

    And some just don't come up in many maps, such as summoning to the death. We only have, what, 3 maps you can do that in, and none are played very often?

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    Chronic, Recoil and myself are the most frequent playing admins there. and since the new classes came out, we've had quite a few new admins who've come and gone. but the prob was they were inforcing rules they didn't know or understand. I find with chronic, recoil and myself, us 3 seem 2 be pretty much on the same page regarding rules. but these new admins would start saying shit that's not true, then the people would start spreading it, and yeah.. we end up with confusing and mixing stories. if zero will allow me I can write the rules for WCS and have zero chron and recoil all look over them, agree and then we could post it on forums and make it official, and add 2 it as new races come out and what not. would probably solve lot's of confusion and give new admins on WCS a guide as 2 how things happen.

    Maynard - The WCS Guy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    "no summing people 2 fall 2 there death. they obviously deserve a fighting chance." I've never heard this, in fact, I've only heard the exact opposite thing (see: the trolley on deathcookin)

    For skywalking: again, return fire with WHAT?
    Any kind of weapon. If you can hit them and they can't hit you, then you can't shoot at them from that spot. Simple as that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    What's the beginning of a round? 5 seconds? 10 seconds? 3 minutes? I won't do it(again) but still, open ended answers are useless.
    If players are still leaving spawn then you should not do it. Is twenty seconds a good enough number for you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    The objective is to rescue hosties/plant/defuse the bomb OR kill all the enemies. It is a team based game, and if you stop the enemy team, you win just as well as if you plant the bomb. This is a just as important goal, since at least as many rounds end due to TPK.
    And if you can't kill the enemies by the end of the round, you aren't doing the objective. That happens a lot with camping, and the other team will just sit in THEIR spawn waiting for the clock to run out. But the thing is they can because their objective is to keep the hostages from being rescued or the bomb from being planted.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    But, making my way to the objective, just because I'm not running in like rambo when I've just been fighting people who I didn't kill, doesn't mean I'm not going to do it. It just means I'm not an idiot. (this comment is for slayings that have happened)
    That's what he said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    We do (sort of) have this unwritten rule, and still, people on both sides camp, even with them being the last ones, and we almost never have 3 minute rounds, and when we do, it's usually down to the wire. Please don't tell me what I or anyone else would do, since you can only tell me what YOU would do.
    If you play in pub or WCS, you see campers A LOT. Just because you don't doesn't mean others don't either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    Also, why 1 minute? Why this arbitrary amount of time? I can plant the bomb in what, 3 seconds? Most maps you can get from one end of the map to the other in about 20 seconds, and with WCS, often less. Why do you force us to rush when we have plenty of time?
    You just said 1 minute is plenty of time, so it isn't anything close to rushing. One minute gives you a good amount of time to be able to be sneaky and keep from getting killed while doing your objective. You seem to be argumentative for arguments sake.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmage View Post
    Oh, and there is also no you(u) in team, but I can find a me On a related note, people who think kdr is the most important factor in determining who is a good player don't understand that this IS a team game, not a solo game.
    Okie dokie smokie.


    And for the record ZERO has not made a specific set of rules to follow. I have been working on a rulebook of my own that features a lot of specific items that I hope he will implement in the future.

    Hope you don't mind me helping out Maynard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Christmas View Post

    Hope you don't mind me helping out Maynard.
    of course not. I just sent Zero a msg asking for permission 2 start an official rule list. I already have most of it written out. if he allows me 2 do it so we can put a end 2 all these questions n confusion then ill get ya 2 hit me up with what ya got. I'm sure you're on the same page as me with most things. hopefully zero sees this soon or my personal msgs 2 him and allows me 2 get started on this. cause we deff need it

    Maynard - The WCS Guy

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