OCCUPY gets out of hand

[elpolloloco]

that non violent protests accomplish absolutely nothing lol....


.

I wouldn't say that. If you do something that causes the entire world to take notice and copy you, and to get 100's of millions of people to talk, you might not overthrow "the evil corporations", but I'd say that's quite an accomplishment.

Not that I would give the occupiers the dignity of being held on the same level, but Ghandi accomplished a hell of a lot without resorting to violence. This is America. Making your voice heard in a huge sonic wave is what our democracy is all about. If you want to call them slackers and dirty hippies that's fine. Lord knows I do. But I think anyone who thinks tons of angry people should just sit on their ass and do nothing don't have any idea what this country is all about. In the last 100 years, hundreds of thousands of American soldiers have fought and died to preserve your right to free speech and to protect against our country turning into a fascist government like Hitler's Germany, Stalin and Mao's Russia and China, and modern day Syria, iran, etc.You can disagree with the message all you want and there are a fair share of spoiled brats out there, but to dismiss the entire movement as just stupid, I think, is a slap in the face to every American that fought and died for this country and what it stands for. Our men and women don't go out and die so we can go shopping, so we can by flatscreen TV's, so we can watch American Idol and to download porn. They do it to preserve our Contitution, which was founded on the freedom to speak out when you don't like the way your country is going.

King George III and most subjects of Britain probably thought the colonists were being a bunch of spoiled brats when they went out and dumped a bunch of tea overboard to protest something as stupid and harmless as a tax on tea and paper. And a few years later we ended up with our own country.

[maynard]

lol america isn't even remotely close 2 being like Nazi Germany was...

I don't think the majority of them are smelly hippies either, I think they are middle and upper class people with nothing better 2 do, so they go around just causing shit pretending they are making some type of significant change when they are in fact not... unless being on the news is some how accomplishing something, that "protest" has accomplished NOTHING. it's a complete joke... and then people start talking the cops and act like they enjoy babysitting a buncha idiots lol... I'm sure they much rather be at home with their families.

yes.. obviously gandhi is an exception... but end result.. like I originally said.. this "protest" is a joke, and will accomplish NOTHING..

[StarsMine]

One thing I compleatly agree with these guys is that lobbiests just need to get the fuck out of congress.
Lobbiests make the laws more then the congressmen do, and the lobbiests laws sure as hell are not for protecting the people.

[elpolloloco]

I don't think the majority of them are smelly hippies either, I think they are middle and upper class people with nothing better 2 do, so they go around just causing shit pretending they are making some type of significant change when they are in fact not... unless being on the news is some how accomplishing something, that "protest" has accomplished NOTHING. it's a complete joke... and then people start talking the cops and act like they enjoy babysitting a buncha idiots lol... I'm sure they much rather be at home with their families.

It may be a joke to you, but not to others. There's a lot of fucked up shit in this country and there is plenty of reason to be angry. Irresponsible people caused a lot of mess with foreclosures but irresponsible banks had a lot to do with it to, yet they get 10's of billions in bailouts. They may not have done anything illegal, but to say they didn't do anything unethical is outrageous. We blew so much money on Iraq when the war was based on a lie and we should have been focusing on Afghanistan. The more you sit back, the more the government tries to inject religion into your laws. The more they try to tax you and create a system of social engineering. If you give the government and inch, it will indeed take that inch from you and see how much more of your freedom you can scoop up. It isn't a system wide conspiracy usually, as much as it is a minority of people with a lot of power power (be it political power or economic power) will do what they can to make the world better for only themselves. Laws are made and broken based on how much money an interest group throws as it. We print more and more money to back up more and more debt causing inflation which is basically a tax on EVERYONE. It's been like that for a while, yes, but when do you decide enough is enough?

America is no NAZI germany, you're right about that. But Nazi Germany wasn't Nazy Germany 20 years prior to WWII. Russia's communist revolution didn't turn the country into a nightmare for human rights overnight. Stalin wouldn't have been able to order troops to literally starve 2 million people to death if years of people hadn't been subjected to years of propaganda that the state is more important that human rights. That shit happens gradually and if you think you see the tides of something unjust coming in, WHY NOT try to bring attention to it rather than wait until there's someone on your doorstep and then you're actually FORCED to violence? Isn't it better to stop what you perceive to be the makings of a fascist government and try to bring attention to it early rather than wait until it's too late?

I feel the same way you do largely about the protestors, but not every one of them are a bunch of middle class whiners. Plenty of them have real reason to be fed up. What good is having free speech if you're not allowed to use it when you think there is a cause for it?

When you get a large group of people together, and the larger it gets, the more "idiots" you've obviously going to get that needed to be "babysat" but you shouldn't make a generalization about 95% of a group based on 5% of them being morons. That's life. There is always going to be a group of morons tagging along, bringing more attention to themselves than to the message the responsible people are trying to bring to light. I think the protests that broke out 10 years ago over the World bank were justified. Some would say that the World bank does more harm to poor nations than good. It's a worthy cause to protest over, but then the Black Block had to go and fuck it all up and discredit the entire movement. They were the small minority that fucked it all up for everyone.

People see the 99% thing and assume people are just pissed that the rich are getting richer. Deep down that's not what people are concerned about. That's just a symptom of the real problem that people are protesting about: An unbalanced amount of influence on the government by the rich.

I have strong opinions on politics, but I don't think any one person can know with 100% certainty what kind of policies are good for the country. Democrats have a point. Republicans have a point. I go about my business knowing that no matter how strongly I feel about a subject, there's always a change that the guy with the opposite opinion *could* be correct. So whether or not I think a movement is going to help or hurt, as long as you're intentions are good and you truly ARE trying to make this county a better place then you DAMN WELL better make sure your voice is heard. Just do your research and try to make sure you know what you're talking about first. Speaking up against what you think is wrong is your DUTY.

[DJ_MikeyRevile]

It may be a joke to you, but not to others. There's a lot of fucked up shit in this country and there is plenty of reason to be angry. Irresponsible people caused a lot of mess with foreclosures but irresponsible banks had a lot to do with it to, yet they get 10's of billions in bailouts. They may not have done anything illegal, but to say they didn't do anything unethical is outrageous. We blew so much money on Iraq when the war was based on a lie and we should have been focusing on Afghanistan. The more you sit back, the more the government tries to inject religion into your laws. The more they try to tax you and create a system of social engineering. If you give the government and inch, it will indeed take that inch from you and see how much more of your freedom you can scoop up. It isn't a system wide conspiracy usually, as much as it is a minority of people with a lot of power power (be it political power or economic power) will do what they can to make the world better for only themselves. Laws are made and broken based on how much money an interest group throws as it. We print more and more money to back up more and more debt causing inflation which is basically a tax on EVERYONE. It's been like that for a while, yes, but when do you decide enough is enough?

America is no NAZI germany, you're right about that. But Nazi Germany wasn't Nazy Germany 20 years prior to WWII. Russia's communist revolution didn't turn the country into a nightmare for human rights overnight. Stalin wouldn't have been able to order troops to literally starve 2 million people to death if years of people hadn't been subjected to years of propaganda that the state is more important that human rights. That shit happens gradually and if you think you see the tides of something unjust coming in, WHY NOT try to bring attention to it rather than wait until there's someone on your doorstep and then you're actually FORCED to violence? Isn't it better to stop what you perceive to be the makings of a fascist government and try to bring attention to it early rather than wait until it's too late?

I feel the same way you do largely about the protestors, but not every one of them are a bunch of middle class whiners. Plenty of them have real reason to be fed up. What good is having free speech if you're not allowed to use it when you think there is a cause for it?

When you get a large group of people together, and the larger it gets, the more "idiots" you've obviously going to get that needed to be "babysat" but you shouldn't make a generalization about 95% of a group based on 5% of them being morons. That's life. There is always going to be a group of morons tagging along, bringing more attention to themselves than to the message the responsible people are trying to bring to light.

People see the 99% thing and assume people are just pissed that the rich are getting richer. Deep down that's not what people are concerned about. That's just a symptom of the real problem that people are protesting about: An unbalanced amount of influence on the government by the rich.

Freedom of speech is not being taken away. You need a clear grasp on why police do what tthey do. There are laws for loitering, curfews, obstruction of noise, violent acts, vandalisim, litering, obstruction of traffic with out city permission. The list goes on, these people are breaking multiple laws and you say there having there freedom of speech taken away?

[elpolloloco]

Freedom of speech is not being taken away. You need a clear grasp on why police do what tthey do. There are laws for loitering, curfews, obstruction of noise, violent acts, vandalisim, litering, obstruction of traffic with out city permission. The list goes on, these people are breaking multiple laws and you say there having there freedom of speech taken away?

I think you misunderstood me. We're bouncing back and forth between two subjects here. I'm not suggesting that our "freedom of speech" is being taken away because of this flashbang incident. I'm talking about something else. Sorry for the confusion.

I'm referring to the people that think this movement is stupid and that these people have no place to be complaining and protesting at all. I'm just saying that whether or not you agree with their cause, if a group of people think they see this country becoming more and more unjust that it's their duty as Americans to make their voices heard and they they shouldn't be dismissed so easily. I'm just saying that our soldiers die every day to make sure we have this right and if someone is going to give their life for this right, then we better make the most of it.

You have some idiots in Oakland and other part of the country that take all the media attention because they act stupid and then people associate EVERYONE with these morons, but sorry. I didn't mean to give the impression that this "freedom of speech" rant had anything to do with the flashbang incident.

To be clear: I'm not suggesting ALL that our freedom is speech is being taken away. I'm suggesting that our freedom is speech is something not to be taken for granted. So many other countries suffer more than we do and don't have this privilege so we should use it when we think there is a cause. There are millions, if not billions of people that wish they had this right, and I think when they see us using these rights, it gives them hope and gives us more worldwide respect.

[Steamer]

What the fuck happened top the constitutional right for peaceful assembly? Oh yes... the lobbyist's beat them the fuck down like every other right.

Constitution broken all over, regardless.

Utter bullshit.

Hell... in my state law makers stole all the road funds and guess who has to fucking pay them back?! Me and every other tax paying fucking citizen. Pollo knows what im talkin bout.

I for one am fed up with all the bullshit, but there is no protesting organization with an agenda of what I like. If I had the funds and means to set one up myself I would.

I work and live within this bullshit every day. It's easy to make assumptions when you do not see it first hand.

In Baltimore there where no laws broken on the assembly, yet made to pack up anyway besides 2 per night. The government dick deepthroating from some people pisses me off so much.

I honestly wish this shit got very violent, maybe there would be some accelerated progress on the actual underlying cause.