Ban Monarch

[diablo]

Steam-ID: STEAM_0:0:1821681
nick monarch
After several players asked me to spec on him i did in the first demo u can see a bit of aimbot, in the second 1 gets clear.

[madmonarch]

Sorry....bit of a noob with demos...how do I view them? lol

[acolyte_to_jippity]

...is he asking how to view the deoms recorded about himself?

[madmonarch]

I was!, This will be my first demo viewing lol!

I figured out from a quick google search on how to do it. Thanks though!

[acolyte_to_jippity]

hmmm, this one's tough. some pretty bullshit shots, but no other obvious signs of hacking, like shakeing or snaping to target.

...

i honestly can't tell here. you'll need someone else to confirm it.

[diablo]

to recognize hacks you need to have used them. I used them a couple of yrs ago on 1.6 for curiosity. And believe me the aimbot can be put anywhere on the enemys body, there are aimbot where the screen doesnt shake at all. But you can see in the fight how his targets moves to the body even to the head even if the guy is reloading.
If 2 admins disagree with me I will unban monarch.

[madmonarch]

I would like to point out a few things.

If you notice while using the AK my shots were on target but there was no one there. Twice I attacked the spot the guy teleported to when he was not there although I thought he was. That's one indication that my gun does not "auto" anything.

One of the times I rushed into long hall and attempted to shoot one of the 3 t's there I completely missed all of them. Even while jumping and looking directly at the one beneath me.

Lastly. The final demo shows a bullshit shot when I tried to go into long amd 4 t's were waiting down the end and started shooting at me. While backing up and panic shooting I had 1 lucky shot to a head but the other shots completely missed targets and my gun aimed down I think at one point while shooting.

::Edit::
I would also like to add that there should be no maybe decisions from admins. I don't know how many admins you have that actively review but if there are only a few then each one should be a yes or no. Otherwise this stays in limbo. With no one to fight for my defense, it is left to me to point out the "other" side. This makes it very difficult.

Also, as per your post diablo. A person "needs" to use a hack to recognize one? Which would imply that a majority of cs users are unqualified to identify a person hacking when in most cases it is blazingly obvious. I can see wall hacks can be hard to spot, not sure how aimbot works but does it line up shots through walls before I go around a corner? That happens at no point in the demos.

I'm not sure how to check my hlstats but if you know how. You should see no trend or indication of previous hacks/bans.

[Spasm]

to recognize hacks you need to have used them. I used them a couple of yrs ago on 1.6 for curiosity. And believe me the aimbot can be put anywhere on the enemys body, there are aimbot where the screen doesnt shake at all. But you can see in the fight how his targets moves to the body even to the head even if the guy is reloading.
If 2 admins disagree with me I will unban monarch.

You should be banned for just trying hacking. Comic anyone?

[Tickle Me Emo]

I can detect no signs of an aimbot in these demos, at 100%/50%/2.5% speeds. There are copious amounts of over-correction; from my impression the aiming is entirely human. There is one lucky headshot in each demo. In the first demo, with the AK down the short hall between long hall and hostage room. In the second demo, with the deagle down the long hall. Neither of these shots appear to be more than luck.

The fact that he was using a deagle / ak the entire duration of the demo also contributes to my doubts - those guns are headshot machines.

As for locking on to bodies, see my note about over-correction. He knows how to manage recoil, but he can't track a target any better than anyone else I've seen.

There was no sign of locking on to targets behind walls.

From these demos, I'd say no hacks.

Edit:



I would also like to add that there should be no maybe decisions from admins. I don't know how many admins you have that actively review but if there are only a few then each one should be a yes or no. Otherwise this stays in limbo. With no one to fight for my defense, it is left to me to point out the "other" side. This makes it very difficult.


Permabans are always reviewed, by whoever feels like reviewing it at any given time. If nothing else, I imagine ZERO or a clan member (as they are the only ones who may unban except the banning admin) would review permabans if no one else had done so. By the same token, if multiple admins have already reviewed the demos, especially older, reputable admins, they would probably not bother unless the banned person pestered them.

That said, it is generally preferred to not take chances of harboring hackers - it is a choice between not banning and potentially allowing hacking to continue, OR to ban and possibly inconvenience a legitimate player. Since this section exists, and legitimate players may plead their case (and other admins may review demos), it is usually preferred to not chance allowing hacking.

[madmonarch]

Thank you for the detailed review of the demo Elmo.

I fully understand and agree with the ban first appeal later process, we use the same process on WTF servers. It is a proven technique and also helps us fill or forums with new and interesting people to socialize with (this doesn't mean we ban people to populate our forums however). This is why I haven't thrown up my arms in argument against diablo but have dealt with this in a respectable debating manner. I agree that a few of the shots that were fired were complete bullshit and I would have specced the player myself. Although I obviously disagree with the implication that I hack based on exacly what your review and opinion of the demo has revealed.

I would love more feedback on this. =)

[maynard]

yeah, I see no signs of hacking. he's clearly startled a few times when ppl come around corners at him, and misses lotts of shots where any 1 hacking wouldn't have.

[acolyte_to_jippity]

You should be banned for just trying hacking. Comic anyone?

don't start.

emo you put it very well.

and monarch, aim hacks can come in many different forms. either constant aims, or toggled. visual range or unlim., certain weaps or all, autofire or manual...

[madmonarch]

don't start.

emo you put it very well.

and monarch, aim hacks can come in many different forms. either constant aims, or toggled. visual range or unlim., certain weaps or all, autofire or manual...

Even if that were the case, on the final demo (Which to me is the breaker), the lucky headshot with the deagle should have been 4 lucky headshots if I was using some sort of hack, even with a toggle I would have had to turn it off right after the first headshot and still be able to fire, strafe, and move backwards all at once.

I never knew there were hacks that were for specific weapons....that one is news to me. Never knew there were toggled hacks before either.

[acolyte_to_jippity]

Even if that were the case, on the final demo (Which to me is the breaker), the lucky headshot with the deagle should have been 4 lucky headshots if I was using some sort of hack, even with a toggle I would have had to turn it off right after the first headshot and still be able to fire, strafe, and move backwards all at once.

I never knew there were hacks that were for specific weapons....that one is news to me. Never knew there were toggled hacks before either.

bind mouse1 "on; fire"
or more correctly, bind q "on; fire"

[madmonarch]

Then with that logic, anyone who gets a headshot could be considered using a hack for toggling it on and off during each fight within a round! LOL. Hacks suck and I hate people who use them, we patrol our WTF servers to rid them just as much as I'm sure you guys do. I'm no expert when it comes to spotting them but I know obvious hacks when I see them, hell I didn't even know how to play demos before this all happened!

Anyways, based on what Diablo said, 2 admins disagree and I get unbanned. Does it have to be him who unbans me or can anyone do it?

[Tickle Me Emo]

Then with that logic, anyone who gets a headshot could be considered using a hack for toggling it on and off during each fight within a round! LOL.

The only way to completely hide even a toggled hack would be to already be pointing at the person's head when you turned it on (to prevent any snap occurring), in which case you could have just pressed the fire button.


Hacks suck and I hate people who use them, we patrol our WTF servers to rid them just as much as I'm sure you guys do. I'm no expert when it comes to spotting them but I know obvious hacks when I see them, hell I didn't even know how to play demos before this all happened!

See, this was an educational experience! :D



Anyways, based on what Diablo said, 2 admins disagree and I get unbanned. Does it have to be him who unbans me or can anyone do it?

Has to be him or a clan member.

[madmonarch]

The only way to completely hide even a toggled hack would be to already be pointing at the person's head when you turned it on (to prevent any snap occurring), in which case you could have just pressed the fire button.

Let's look at this deeper though, I'm pretty good with logic. If the hack was toggled via the fire key, and based on the demos, I would have to have unbound the fire key during the final fight and continued to fire, strafe, and move backwards to avoid the "snap". Although this could have indicated I used another toggle key such as Q but again based on the demo it strafed left and right a few times using the Q key and it would have had to toggle on and off with a noticeable "snap"......But again, even further! That's to say my strafe key is actually Q!....and as if this writing I realize that no, my strafe is indeed not Q but A! I'm so smart I fool myself sometimes.

I don't even remember what Q does, I think it switches weapons by default doesn't it?

[Tickle Me Emo]

Let's look at this deeper though, I'm pretty good with logic. If the hack was toggled via the fire key, and based on the demos, I would have to have unbound the fire key during the final fight and continued to fire, strafe, and move backwards to avoid the "snap". Although this could have indicated I used another toggle key such as Q but again based on the demo it strafed left and right a few times using the Q key and it would have had to toggle on and off with a noticeable "snap"......But again, even further! That's to say my strafe key is actually Q!....and as if this writing I realize that no, my strafe is indeed not Q but A! I'm so smart I fool myself sometimes.

LOL wow.


I don't even remember what Q does, I think it switches weapons by default doesn't it?

Yes it does.

[madmonarch]

Anyways, thanks for the support Elmo, I'll have to check back later to see if the ban has been lifted. Take care for now!

[acolyte_to_jippity]

...emo.

elmo is creepy. emo is an admin

[Rapedollar$]

inconclusive.

unbanned.