Races question

[Wolfenstinger]

Apparently I never posted what I was gonna say earlier.... whatever...

Sum it up : if you want me to make a list based off of the use of a Necklace of Immunity, I can. It'd just be from the perspective of what I see more threatening as a normal Vagalion player due to THINGS I DON'T LIKE GETTING STUCK BY. But as far as making these lists go, it's extremely biased off of my own opinion as what I see as a major threat or annoyance as of now.

Also I don't see any of the races "weak" such as Die Xonvert or Archmage. They are placed there for my entertainment value of "how longs it take for me to get my knife in you?" game.

[Blackmage]

Given your list is all about which is most annoying to a lion rather than powerful on the server in general, the necklace input wouldn't help. The list you give is helpful for something else I've been looking at for a LONG time, and your comments help as a corollary.

Given you have a full ranking list, how much thought was put into the various rankings, or was it more "This race exists and isn't THAT annoying"?

[Passarelli]

Lawl, no wonder I thought your list was funny.

[Wolfenstinger]

I've put a decent amount of thought into the list since like mid-late 2011. Sometime around there I had a hand-written "How to Vagalion" guide constructed as well which, 85-95% of everything in it could still be used to today. Though, if you really want to imagine what was scribbled down in it, it's to not be so stupid and get creative with what you do. Also have fun. Lots of fun. If you aren't having fun, then what are you doing? If I can recall, I even put in how to find a Vagalion very easily... which it was still pretty accurate when I experimented with it again when I was leveling on WCS.

Granted I don't play with shopmenu items like they are sent from the heavens everytime i'm winning, and I can play very... VERY... recklessly... creating a "Necklace of Immunity" based list would be useful only towards Vagalion more than Vagabond due to the range difference. In reality though, this list would look like this :

33. Vagalion
32. Vagabond
31. Rapscallion
30 - 01. Everyone Else.

^-- it's very accurate. But however, there are also many factors that I've put in such as Vagalion with a Necklace and without. The whole reason I play without a necklace is because if you DO have one, are human, and tele in my direction.... You can do that, and not know I'm there. The little things that play big factors in WCS that people overlook. Those moments where people seriously stand still and are like "I GOT HIM GUYS!!!" while I'm still sitting across the map staring at them this whole time invisible... Yeah. You people know who you are... And you know I always try to stab the guy screaming. They always make the funniest reactions when they die.

But yes, there is a difference between my Necklace of Immunity list and my Power-House list. Granted, I've played my fair share of Archmage before people thought it was cool, and played Succubus Hunter alongside people like Xerenix as well, again... BEFORE it was cool... Yeh, I have lots of information I could share still on my thoughts of individual races and their personal rankings I give.

[Erdenay]

This is my list. My assumptions are: a regular map (not something like Nipperhouse or port where some races gain exponential strength), max level, full items and a player is of exceptional quality (I.E. someone who can use the race to the best of its abilities).

33. Rapscallion
32. Hell-hunter
31. Warden
30. Panorama^1
29. Chameleon
28. Magician^2
27. Dragonfly
26. Orc
25. Eye Ra
24. Shadow of the Void
23. Genocide^3
22. Flame Predator
21. Beast
20. Bloodmage^4
19. Undead Scourge
18. Night Elf
17. Raiden
16. Die Xonvert
15. Crypt Lord^5
14. Archmage Proudmore
13. Succubus Hunter^6
12. Strider
11. Athena
10. Hells Demon
9. Shadow Hunter
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think there's a HUGE gap between all of the previous races and the following 8 (or the BIG 8). With truly skillful players, any of these can be nigh unplayable.
8. Vagalion
7. Santa
6. Jack
5. Nebula^7
4. Molecule
3. Spiderman
2. Human
1. Vagabond

^1 - this race can increase in value a lot for the TEAMPLAY if you have someone who has a high skill ceiling and is selfless (doesn't care about stats), so the potential for this race in a 10 v 10 for me would be significantly different than just overall strength of the race in most situations.
^2 - Magician is an interesting case as it can potential be up at Big 8 (invisible bird with 150 health), but the randomness and overall situation leaves this race quite low.
^3 - same as ^1 (panorama)
^4 - Bloodmage's value significantly increases in large team situations (10 v 10) and a large amount of bloodmages can overpower nearly anything by raw force (we've done such an experiment).
^5 - Somewhat same situation as Athena ---> this race is incredibly powerful in the winning team, but significantly worse in the losing situations. Both of these races can possibly be even in top 5 as far as devastation goes, but it's not consistent, thus the low place.
^6 - A full powered up succubus hunter can be nearly unkilleable, but considering the effort needed to get it powered up starting the first round it suffers from a relatively low placement.
^7 - Nebula, IMO, can possibly as the single MOST USEFUL race in WCS in the right team environments: it is incredibly strong in dueling (1v1) and swarming scenarios (1v5+), but it also gives one of the best tools for the team to succeed, so I'd possibly rate it as the strongest 10v10 race out there.

As noted above, these assessments were done in case of the nearly perfect player example. If I'd have to say the race strength on average, I'd pick human, spiderman and molecule as three strongest races probably followed by hells demon and then Athena or Crypt Lord. Race strength also varies drastically with maps, players and teams, so it is incredibly difficult to pin it down.

[kionay]

Magician is an interesting case as it can potential be up at Big 8 (invisible bird with 150 health), but the randomness and overall situation leaves this race quite low.

none too fond am i of the memories of deez destroying with magician, crow specifically
(side note: why can't i find him on PsychoStats ? did he get ibis/vac banned or something?)

Bloodmage's value significantly increases in large team situations (10 v 10) and a large amount of bloodmages can overpower nearly anything by raw force (we've done such an experiment).

haha yeah i remember doing something like this, all repsawns all day, i remember ronnie getting pissed we'd respawn so much he ran out of ammo
probably one of the most fun things to do, really

And you know I always try to stab the guy screaming. They always make the funniest reactions when they die.

fuck.

[Passarelli]

Kionay, he likely fell off the stats page from inactivity.

[kionay]

Kionay, he likely fell off the stats page from inactivity.

didn't know that was a thing since it says several thousand people's stats and searching 'deez' comes up nothing

unless he originally went by something else and the search doesn't take into account all aliases (which isn't unreasonable)

if wcs stays dead too much longer everyone will get wiped off then XD

[CYBER]

didn't know that was a thing since it says several thousand people's stats and searching 'deez' comes up nothing

unless he originally went by something else and the search doesn't take into account all aliases (which isn't unreasonable)

if wcs stays dead too much longer everyone will get wiped off then XD

when someone goes inactive for too long, their stats aren't reachable anymore by search and they fall off the list.
the ONLY way to get their stats is to google their steam id or commonly used name ALONG with "wcs_stats"
for example "cyber ibis.a wcs_stats" and it would open up a cached version of that stats page.

source: i use that shit all the time when looking up bypassers.



also :

HUMAN is the most OP race in the game to anyone who can land 1 bullet.
the rest is situational depending on the map...
but human's one of those races with zero weaknesses and can be played in ANY map, no matter what... which shouldn't be the case....
for example, the difficulty of playing molecule in dolls.
etc

[kionay]

when someone goes inactive for too long, their stats aren't reachable anymore by search and they fall off the list.
the ONLY way to get their stats is to google their steam id or commonly used name ALONG with "wcs_stats"
for example "cyber ibis.a wcs_stats" and it would open up a cached version of that stats page.

source: i use that shit all the time when looking up bypassers.



also :

HUMAN is the most OP race in the game to anyone who can land 1 bullet.
the rest is situational depending on the map...
but human's one of those races with zero weaknesses and can be played in ANY map, no matter what... which shouldn't be the case....
for example, the difficulty of playing molecule in dolls.
etc

solution: learn how to code the source plugins for the game and help ZERO balance/remake the races

there, now was that so hard? :P